Any classical musicians on here? Simon?

I'm just wondering what on earth it is that persuades the organisers of these historic concerts - almost without exception - to wrap one piece of popular and pleasant music with a couple of bits of unlistenable-to cacophony.

Er, I mean, expose the listener to modern talented composers, of course.

I really don't buy this idea. These are supposed to be popular concerts, but I'd lay money on a survey of the audience (currently rapt with earache interest) revealing that the vast majority tonight are there for the Elgar (or just to be at the Proms).

Currently, Harrison Birtwhistle has had the orchestra tuning up for the last twenty minutes, with Daniel Baremboim pointlessly waving a stick at the front. Even the orchestra look unamused.

Hopefully, we might arrive at some Elgar soon.

Sorry Neil, just caught up with this.

I admit to being no fan either of a Clapham Junction soundtrack superimposed on one from Piccadilly Circus but in fairness there are those whose aural fantasies are mysteriously attracted by the likes of the more experimental composers of which you speak.

I guess many around us are not particularly turned on by Beethoven or Shostakovich just as say boy-bands are not my cup of tea.

I do however have a penchant for Stevie Wonder and a selection of Slipknot, Slayer, Soulfly and Dream Theatre

I was delighted to discover that the etymology of 'cacophony' means, literally, sounds like sh....

Indeed it is!

I've seen Philip Glass about eight or nine times, and they've been both terrible (Shepherds Bush Empire with the Kronos Quartet) and absolutely fantastic (SouthBank, live operatic arrangement to Jean Cocteau's La Belle et la Bête). If you're saying that waving a nylon flag to Land of Hope and Glory beats this, you're wrong.

That's interesting....it also proves once again that each work/occasion should be judged on its own merit.

Even one's "favourite composers/groups have bad 'uns.....

But it sort of comes down to the environment. Queen Elizabeth Hall on the Southbank, the Barbican, Wigmore Hall, Brixton Academy, the Forum are great venues - in London - for live music.

Shepherds Bush Empire is crap for classical, the Royal Albert Hall is pretty rubbish for everything. At the end of the day, acoustics win.

Definitely....sound is enhanced or suppressed by the environment it bounces off.

What irritates me is the non-pianist (string/wind player, singer) who insists a grand piano "must" be too loud when the lid is fully open in concert situation - it's actually designed to be so for clarity, otherwise, half-closed or worse, fully down, it's not dissimilar to speaking with one's hand over one's mouth.

I don't argue that 'modern' classical is intrinsically better or worse than the more familiar stuff from the previous three hundred years; music evolves and tastes evolve and mine obviously haven't.

I merely point out that the subset of people who like both must be tiny and that the two styles of music don't go together, and the Prom's habit of scheduling the two types on the same bill doesn't help the fans of either.

(for the record: my father reckons that as a baby my first recognisable noise was humming along to Beethoven's sixth symphony.)