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my 2.5..will she or wont she? #1206019
23/04/2011 17:43
23/04/2011 17:43

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



for those that have followed my build i now have my car near run in ,
i have to say it sounds awesome and but for the slimline fan not being able to regulate the temp quickly enough for my liking it's running flawlessly

untill i sort out another solution we have had to remove the aircon rad and move everything as far forward as possible and squeeze the originals in... which are working a treat for now, though i expect that wont last as they are 2 millimeters away from the turbo and touching the manifold at 1 point i think ,so i don't hold out much hope for the bearings when i start boosting the turbo untill its glowing!

the car is unmapped and on a gtec chip yet we have seen 1/2 a bar at 3k! already and i have had to drive with a very light foot and let revs build gently...i don't like the thought of my turbo bearings and that crappy mineral oil!

i go on tuesday to have a dta ecu wired in and over the week get it mapped though we can only go to about 550 as the rollers can not cope with much more and i will have to go back a few weeks later as john(mapper) is having new rollers for upto 1000 bhp installed

i am so impressed and glad that the car has been so easy to get on with and not given any problems at all for which i have to say a big thanks to barbz who is just an incredible and enthusiatic tuner/engineer/engine builder as some of the solutions he has come up with for various problems we came up against are just brilliant and i believe completely that very few people could have built a set up as good as this..

it's not just about forging internals and bolting on a big turbo..some of the over seas guys have done that and we have seen there power graphs...not a lot happening at all then it all happens over a few thousand revs..no problem with that if thats what you want but to build an engine thats so civilised and easy to use and yet will out perform most supercars for a fraction of the cost is no mean feat..i may be jumping the gun here as i am yet to be mapped and the mappers skill will come into play also,but from the performance so far and from driving barbz which is similar upto a point ,i am sure it will do what i asked him for..and you have to respect the guy that designed and built it as he went with a new piston design and everything from the headwork to head/valve design,manifold diameter pipework etc were all designed to make the type of engine i required..this was not just some buy everything off the shelf and fit together job but a proffesional aproach to a cohesive whole he was trying to achieve and has done so exceptionally well..just brilliant

i wanted a car i could drive everyday that was good and easy in traffic smooth to drive if i was running round with the wife and kids yet brutal enough to beat every coupe in the uk if i wanted to ( i also said i would like to see 600bhp without race fuel)but that wasn't first priority ..seriously thats what i asked him for! and it is real smooth and real easy to drive in fact the hardest thing about it is the clutch which although is no major issue is quite "well sprung" shall we say laugh

so i have everything i wanted, the final ask will not be known for a while though, as i say johns rollers may not be able to cope but will she or wont she?

for those thinking of doing similar i will say this if you are not going to use the extra 100 bhp don't do it!.. its pretty straight forward to do a 500 bhp 2.4 as you can use the standard manifold though it will need barbz to work on it for that ..and you can use standard garret turbos even internal wastegate so its all straight forward stuff..the amount of extra money it costs to take it to over 600 and have a clutch and other parts that can cope is not at all in proportion to the extra gains

theres also a lot of extra work in trying to get a much bigger manifold,a turbo twice the size of the original and air cooled,an external gate,plumbing for it all to fit and not to cause massive issues with heat etc(especially when a awkward owner wants to keep his aircon..i wont even start on the things that have gone into the build that have never been (or needed to be) on other coupes it really does have a lot of 1 off and original parts and solutions.

all in all i couldn't be happier with the car and am looking forward to seeing what it can do


Last edited by ktm450exc; 23/04/2011 17:47.
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206022
23/04/2011 17:48
23/04/2011 17:48

P
proccy
Unregistered
proccy
Unregistered
P



Rob that sounds like quite a revolutionary project you and Barbz have achieved, can't wait to see and hear it in action someday soon - fair play, i bet this wasn't a cheap option either

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206029
23/04/2011 18:11
23/04/2011 18:11

B
Biggenz
Unregistered
Biggenz
Unregistered
B



I've seen your car many times(while in bits) at Barbz, and I must say, it will be fascinating to see what you can get out of it.

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206038
23/04/2011 18:26
23/04/2011 18:26
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,293
Sandhurst
Begbie Offline
Ex El Presidente
Begbie  Offline
Ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,293
Sandhurst
Look forward to seeing the results, but would love to see some pics of the engine bay with how everything is all fitted together smile


Originally Posted by Jonny - After being taken out at Spa
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206040
23/04/2011 18:34
23/04/2011 18:34

J
johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
johnnybravoturbo
Unregistered
J



All im saying is i hope it goes alot smoother than mine mate and you have no teething issues.

Also i suggest you fit that big brake kit asap. laugh


Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206047
23/04/2011 19:02
23/04/2011 19:02

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



proccy..hi mate sorry about your car ..i saw it myself and really feel for you its such a nice one it would have been a shame to do anything but fix it and fair play to you for that..good luck with it all


when i decided to go 2.4 i was thinking that if i was going to put serious money into building one i wanted to build something special rather than another 450 or so which is achievable for reasonable money now its a well trodden path so to speak..
luckily i spoke to barbz about it first and he had the enthusiasm for this and once we started talking about possibilities that was it! we spent 2 and 3 hours a night on the phone for weeks working it out and sorting/sourcing it all etc and at that point it seemed like we would do a good 2.4 at the same money a 450 2l would cost as thats quite easy..!..

unfortunately or fortunately depending on whether you think financially or strictly of the car!... as time went by i found all sorts of things out and discovered all sorts of parts on the internet and just couldn't help myself..
at that point budget went out of the window and it was about buying the best i could afford..i got the best turbo i could find though barbz had to temper me to the version i have now as i was going for the model above which can give 800bhp(would have thrown up even more issues that would need solving) same with manifold,wastegate etc..it became obvious we could only make so much power usable so that dictated engine spec to some degree..
again with the rest of the car i thought it pointless putting such a motor in a chassis that wasn't capable of exploiting it so i set about that in the same way and although i had accumulated masses of parts the only bit i used was the aquamist! so suspension i decided to go new so as to get it to handle well ...arbs,brakes,bushes,etc followed as i thought i would make it as good as i could
finally when barbz fitted the motor to jamies old green coupe i decided i would go on a mission to find a nicer one..my thinking was after spending all that money do i want a standard green(my least favourite colour) car? the answer to that came 1/2 dozen coupes later in my ink black plus which has a real solid chasis and good bodywork ..i am now making it lighter with new lightwieght seats(though they have to be recliners for getting kids in),hopefully grp bonnet(second hand) and other mods to lighten it..

all in because of the route i took and the spec i went for, including car itself and including my mapping next week...£15k i think i have not had the nads yet to add it all up

i have to say this though ..again as a testament to barbz.. if i had been charged by the hour it would have been £50k! seriously barbz has spent so much time and trouble on this project, over and above that agreed, it's not fair! and i mean it's genuinely not fair on him..
he costed a build that was simple and with some hours to be spent on the chasis also..it turns out to have been massively under priced ..heres an example..to get a clutch to cope and not need replacing quickly, he had to develop in conjunction with helix, a clutch which was to be the highest rated,biggest surface area unit so far ..that on its own meant fitting, refitting,sending bits off to be machined,bits back to helix..fit again, measure,send back etc etc..the whole project has been a bit like it..he has also built the car once then stripped and transferred the lot to another chassis..but its the late nights finding solutions..making brackets,taking stuff to be made or re engineered,fitting ,removing adjusting then refitting as everything is none standard and nothing would have fitted had he just tried to use the standard set up..
he really has been a complete star and would not take more than the estimate he gave as he knew i had over specced it and could not afford the spec i bought never mind a massive bill from him so he decided to do it to the best of his ability for the sake of the car and our new friendship..lets be honest who else would have done that? (though johnny bravo has helped me also above and beyond) obviously i owe barbz big time and i will have to deal with that over time but like me he just wanted to see what we could achieve with the spec i bought and was still as enthusiastic about it at the end though he wasn't getting paid anywhere near his lowest rate!
so it wouldn't be running at all but for his generosity with his time..

hope it bloody lives up to our expectations after all this!

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206050
23/04/2011 19:07
23/04/2011 19:07

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



ill get some pics up soon nigel

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206054
23/04/2011 19:11
23/04/2011 19:11

P
patch234
Unregistered
patch234
Unregistered
P



Originally Posted By: ktm450exc
ill get some pics up soon nigel


wink

Sounds like a great car Rob. Fair play and good luck with it. thumb

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206057
23/04/2011 19:19
23/04/2011 19:19

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



thanks it does need your input though patch to make it as nice as it can be so if you have the time and inclination next time you are over?

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206062
23/04/2011 19:25
23/04/2011 19:25

B
BoostMeCoupeUp
Unregistered
BoostMeCoupeUp
Unregistered
B



Wow you told me it was going to be special and Barbz was THE man but he sounds like he's made you a super car slayer.

Good luck with the mapping, hope its as useable as you want and not nothing nothing here comes the boost 650bhp change gear like the other big turbo jobbys I know yours wont be that.

Reading all that makes me even more glad I stayed strong and didn't sell you my Black Le because if I knew that engine was in what would feel like MY car it would have made my insanely jelous.

Get the pics up AND a vid and are you going to get it to pod this summer?

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206063
23/04/2011 19:26
23/04/2011 19:26

P
patch234
Unregistered
patch234
Unregistered
P



Originally Posted By: ktm450exc
thanks it does need your input though patch to make it as nice as it can be so if you have the time and inclination next time you are over?


No problem Rob, it's about time we met face to face. We'll chat when I'm back smile

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206073
23/04/2011 19:41
23/04/2011 19:41
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,887
Cumbria
flyingcustard Offline
My life on the forum
flyingcustard  Offline
My life on the forum

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,887
Cumbria
Rob,is it ok for me and possably scal_LE33(red plus ;)) to pop in at JDM for a peep? Have you seen his new rollers!? they are MASSIVE evil

Dave


Plus/LE33

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206098
23/04/2011 20:59
23/04/2011 20:59
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,486
London Tan
technics Offline
I need some sleep
technics  Offline
I need some sleep

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,486
London Tan
All sounds amazing, respect to Barbz and yourself.


Now in the 400+ bhp club!
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206200
24/04/2011 10:08
24/04/2011 10:08

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



As far as i'm concerned your welcome to come and see what it does and have a nose round the car, i'll be up tuesday but i would imagine he'll just be wiring it in...i should think thursday/friday will probably be the days when she's actually on the rollers!

I was tempted to wait until his new rollers went in but its no good driving her unmapped so we'll just go as far as we can with the set up he has at the minute...when John first started his tunning i believe that there were very few cars that could max his rollers out!

Last edited by ktm450exc; 24/04/2011 10:17.
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206203
24/04/2011 10:29
24/04/2011 10:29

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



Oh and John as soon as you've got a sspace mate...brakes and maybe get the seats and harnesses in...

one last thing about the car...the gear shift is just sublime its nothing like a coupe at all anymore..i don't want to keep banging on about barbz like some brown nosed sychophant but again this is another example of the way he works ..spending hours and hours just to get the gear shift perfect with the type of car it is and the way its going to be used...he had an idea in mind for a proper slick shift and again for no extra cost and just for the sake of doing it right he had some unheard of metal bits made up along with other mods and has created by far the best shift of any car i've yet driven. its a mod i would recomend to anyone

Last edited by ktm450exc; 24/04/2011 10:34.
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206205
24/04/2011 10:40
24/04/2011 10:40

T
Taz
Unregistered
Taz
Unregistered
T



get a gearbox cooler pal, i think you'll need it wink

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206265
24/04/2011 13:39
24/04/2011 13:39

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



yes mate i am looking at options there and already have a spare box waiting! but thats another thing needs doing as i can afford it..build a gearbox to compliment the car that is

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206267
24/04/2011 13:42
24/04/2011 13:42
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,252
Windsor/ Reading
knight7660 Offline
Competition Level
knight7660  Offline
Competition Level

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,252
Windsor/ Reading
good to hear its going so well ktm cant wait to see it on the move


LE53 (452BHp & 389ftlb's with Quaife)
Wine red VIS FOOFY
Audi RS4 B7
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206306
24/04/2011 16:01
24/04/2011 16:01
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 117
north west
watz Offline
On a journey
watz  Offline
On a journey

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 117
north west
glad to hear its finally on the move rob.

when your ready, can you post up a full spec list for us all to drool over? laugh
carnt wait for the results.

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206432
24/04/2011 22:48
24/04/2011 22:48

P
porkypaul
Unregistered
porkypaul
Unregistered
P



Good work Rob can't wait see it.

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206477
25/04/2011 08:27
25/04/2011 08:27

T
tricky
Unregistered
tricky
Unregistered
T



Well it all sounds very interesting, I know first hand how a project like this can be so demanding. Is there not a project thread I can read ? I could only find this - Thread

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206493
25/04/2011 09:18
25/04/2011 09:18
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,293
Sandhurst
Begbie Offline
Ex El Presidente
Begbie  Offline
Ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,293
Sandhurst
Rob, I asked for pics, not Nigel smile


Originally Posted by Jonny - After being taken out at Spa
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206504
25/04/2011 10:40
25/04/2011 10:40

N
Nazo
Unregistered
Nazo
Unregistered
N



Cool stuff indeed ktm..

Saw the new inky plus during the engine transfer stage and it looked better then green one, by miles.

However JBT's black coop looked like one mean assassin.. love

I would say lets see what the actual figures are before we jump to any conclusions..Whatever the outcome its all about how YOU feel about it, that's my opinion on it.

Lastly, whats with the new friendship,or is it more laugh wink ahhhem

"so he decided to do it to the best of his ability for the sake of the car and our new friendship."

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206524
25/04/2011 11:56
25/04/2011 11:56

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



tricky sorry about that! i binned that one it was probably not a good idea using mostly second hand parts and trying to do it for very little,though it was possible..
there will be a full spec list when its mapped and we have some figures and graphs..
as a written project to distill the last eight months and all the little and large issues into a readable thing is too daunting a task at the minute as i am so busy but we will do some sort of outline with pics at some point

sorry begbie i must have been tired!

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206525
25/04/2011 11:59
25/04/2011 11:59

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



nazo..do you have to? laugh
what i meant by that was..you can't help but become friends when you are doing something like this and both have the same enthusiasm for it..it was not the same situation as taking it to a garage and saying right do this and getting a bill...we spent a lot of time working it out and discussing it ..he is a genuinely nice guy and an honest and generous one.. which was refreshing and i couldn't be anything but friendly with someone with such a good spirit and he did a lot of the work out of that generosity of spirit rather than trying to extract all the financial gain he could from the situation, as is the case with some of the specialists and garages i have come across...
hope you can see what i mean

Last edited by ktm450exc; 25/04/2011 12:06.
Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206542
25/04/2011 13:03
25/04/2011 13:03

P
proccy
Unregistered
proccy
Unregistered
P



we're not talking "friendship" as in marco are we Rob? laugh

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206547
25/04/2011 13:26
25/04/2011 13:26

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



ok i give up... where do i get the purple jumper? any room for more gaymigos?

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206554
25/04/2011 13:50
25/04/2011 13:50

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



ok i give up... where do i get the purple jumper? any room for more gaymigos?

a little update...i have blown the first box in the exhaust at the seams and thats without going over 3.5k revs and 1/2 bar boost so am now looking into options on the boxes as who knows what will happen at 7700 rpm and 1.6 bar

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206557
25/04/2011 14:02
25/04/2011 14:02

A
Al_Galone
Unregistered
Al_Galone
Unregistered
A



You mean exhaust box?
How many of them do you have?

Re: my 2.5..will she or wont she? [Re: ] #1206561
25/04/2011 14:22
25/04/2011 14:22

K
ktm450exc
Unregistered
ktm450exc
Unregistered
K



2 as i had to have the first one a distance from the manifold as its ceramic coated inside and out and will be transferring a lot of heat..we had stainless wool in the first as wadding would likely just burn up..they are large silencers though..i am thinking of a race cat as it may be a help with dissipitating the heat..thats probably the wrong word as its covection i think with heat but you know what i mean

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