No, I don't use that term actually, and I agree with the laws of this country, but sadly I know this area better than you do, and the likelihood of these men being guilty is very high.
I have a right to an opinion, just like everyone else on here - one of the many other things I enjoy as a citizen of this country.

This is a regular occurrence in this area, and I have merely vented my frustration at yet another inevitably low sentence. Ever wondered why sentences for fraud against huge corporations is so high, and sentences for more common, yet evil crimes like this are so low??
Answer = fraud at high level is lower than crimes like this, and there are not enough prisons to hold the people who commit all these crimes for long lengths of time. The government would rather deter criminals for monetary crimes and crimes against the big corporations they are in cahoots with than crimes against the common man which doesn't affect the government to as great a degree.
Are you telling me seriously that you have never expressed your immediate frustration at something? Are you telling me that every single word out of your mouth carefully considers every possible argument and circumstance? No. I am allowed to vent my anger, especially at something which I live so near to.

Where you live, and your supposed frustration at your experiences there, has nothing whatsoever to do with your misrepresentation of what Emjay wrote.

I do not live where the problem is. If you had bothered to read my post properly you will see that I say;

This is a regular occurrence in this area

Clearly you know better than everyone else, so we will agree to disagree.

Ah well, a less gracious person might say that if you had bothered to read my post properly you would not have had any need to try and deflect the point Azzura cogently makes.

Ah well, there will always be 1 or 2 (lefty's) in life that dont live in the real world where people express themselves and vent their spleens.

Over and out.

Your venting at the nature of the alleged crimes still has nothing whatsoever to do with bizzarely accusing Emjay of being PC & softly softly, and now both of us of being "lefty's", simply for the handicap of actually knowing what we are talking about when it comes to the legal system.

As for the real world, rather than knowing people who know people, I spend every day in areas like the one you refer to, dealing with courts, criminals, police, prisons , the whole damn caboodle. I'm a 6'5" former nightclub doorman and karate instructor, who runs a lovely capitalist-like business. It makes a refreshing change to be called a lefty - weird, but a change nonetheless.

I hope to god you never end up on jury service hoban

I see no-one has mentioned their ethnicity?

If people from other cultures and beliefs, with completely different views of women come into our society, then aren't sick occurances like this more likely to happen?

Believe me, "British" men have been doing exactly the same thing for thousands of years ...

So is this in your opinion/knowledge an unfounded trend being reported across the nation against muslims, and that brits/poles/lithuanians etc involved on the same scale? I only ask having known someone involved in the Derby episode of a couple of years back, I have no personal axe to grind with any of them.

What do you mean "unfounded trend"? Clearly there is evidence to support the charges. But there are thousands of rape/sexual assault/grooming cases reported and prosecuted every year and whilst minor details like the ethnicity of the perpetrators may differ, they all have one thing in common - Those responsible are horrible excuses for human beings who exploit children for their own sexual gratification.

Where, for example, was the reference to race and ethnicity when the various cases arose about 18 months ago when organised gangs of (white British) male and female sexual predators targetted children in nurseries and shared the photo and video evidence of their crimes?

^^ yup, pedophiles come in all shapes, sizes, sizes, religions and skins colours.

There are plenty of white men that choose to visit asian countries to satisfy their own perverted urges.

Dont get mixed up in the "Muslims picking on white girls". I am pretty sure that if there were young pretty asian girls they would equally be at risk.

Agreed. The differences or similarities are not of colour or creed, but of character. One finds a mixture wherever one goes.

I was referring to the 'real world' in the sense that everyone, including you, expresses themselves in short, sharp, passionate ways every day. If I was in a proper debate, such as on TV, then clearly my orginal response to the story and photo would have been more considered and include more details and information, not be one sentence long. However, there are always people like yourself that are unable to let people just have abit of a rant and vent their immediate reaction; people who seemingly would prefer eveyone to behave like computers and process every piece of information, and report back in a completely objective manner with no emotion whatsoever. This is what I mean by you not living in the real world. If I want to have a rant, I will, it's my right, and I am responsible enough to fully consider details when I need to.

And why are you telling me your vital statistics? It's not a dating site.

They would be better off committing

Just for those with no humour... that was a joke.

It's namby pamby nonsense like that from molly-coddling reds and socialists like you that have brought this country to its' knees.

I bet you use the phrase "PC gone mad" every day, don't you?

It's namby pamby nonsense like that from molly-coddling reds and socialists like you that have brought this country to its' knees.[/quote]

I bet you use the phrase "brought this country to its knees' every day don't you?
Haha.

I cant be arsed anymore your talking bollocks

Hoban81, have a rant by all means, post concisely by all means. Exercise your free speech. But please don't whine when others do the same. Be prepared to accept others exercising the same right and pulling you up for trotting out "political correctness" and "lefties" nonsense to try and detract from informed posts others wish to make.

I appreciate it can be simpler to rant rather than think about issues and engage with them on a deeper level. Just be glad that some of us are trying to engage with issues rather than just ranting in response!

I suppose what i mean is this is the type of case so loved by the mail online, amongst others, and with your undoubted greater knowledge of actual issues as opposed to media ones, is it an unfair representation of muslims being reported as doing all this when there are an equal number of other races/religions involved? It's just that those never seem to get the same level or quantity of pubilicity, and i merely wondered if it was just poor journalism. I mean no slur against any race/religion/creed just the perception created by the media

Having had time to reflect upon what others have posted and how I reacted to the story I now realise that, regardless of colour or religion, they should still be treated to a noose within minutes of the guilty verdict being given.

And I'll still not lose any sleep if the country suddenly grew a pair and allowed it.

Proccy -

Anything reported by the media , but particularly the print media, must be viewed with very large pinches of salt I'm afraid as they all skew stories for one reason or another. For example , the Daily Mail likes to print the same story several times within a short timeframe, sometimes with names and other details , sometimes without, and the only real reason for this is to create a false impression that there have in fact been multiple offences when there has only been one. They just like "stirring"!

I have read press coverage of cases and only realised that they were supposed to be cases I in fact dealt with when I got to my name being printed at the end of the article, with just about everything else being wildly inaccurate.

Criminals, like most people, trust people like themselves so if they form gangs to commit crimes those gangs will usually be homogenous. If they have a particular target in mind for a particular type of crime those targets will be generally homogenous, whether it is elderly people living alone who are easy game for roofing frauds, teenagers wiith expensive igadgets or young girls who may be preyed upon sexually.

Simple population statistics tell us that muslim or Asian members of society are in a minority but 2 or 3 similar cases are being reported in a way that suggests there are hundreds of the exact same type of case when there are, in fact, not. The press always chooses what it wants to print very carefully - an example is the "asylum seeker not deported because of cat" case. The guy appealed on every ground he could think of - including the cat - so the appeal court had to refer to every ground in his paperwork. They in fact discounted the care of the cat as a reason for him to stay but allowed it on other reasons , but because of the press reporting everyone "knows" he was allowed to stay in the UK because he owned a cat.

I don't know if your post about the press is directed at me, Azzura, but if it is you're making a mistake a number of others have in the past. I care very little for the press, especially the Daily Mail. I fully understand that their reporting is not simply done with a slant, but actively designed to whip up righteous indignation.

I don't need a newspaper (or even the Mail) to respond how I do. I'm simply a sociopath, especially when it comes to those who have, by even the most liberal of attitudes, commited a disgusting crime. If [when] they are found guilty of anything like that of which they have been accused then I still think they should hang.

Have a nice day.

Are you Proccy? If not, you've answered your own question.

Unless I'm much mistaken hoban I think that remark may have been tongue-in-cheek.....



It's clear you don't actually live in the area yet but one could see why it might have been understood that you did.
Sure, nothing wrong in your indignation that people have got off with scant punishment for similar crimes in the past, I couldn't agree more, but each case must be judged on its merits. That's a law which we strive hard to maintain.

There always one liberal who has to mention the mail online . If you go back to my original post the article was from the guardian . Whether its form the sun or guardian you cant hide the facts about the case .

I think you find you are wrong . The BBC did a programme on this last year and asian girls were off limits to these predators . One of the reasons was that if they were caught with an asian girl families would get involved and they would be shamed in there own communities and this was from an asian community worker who deals with this everyday .

Oh dear.