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Suspension/Body Braces #1404473
17/01/2013 13:48
17/01/2013 13:48

T
tom_snelling
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tom_snelling
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T



Hi all,

Just looking into more bracing for my 16VT track day car. I already have a front upper brace and the rear upper brace. Ive seen that a 156 lower brace fits, is this correct.

Also are there any other worthwhile braces out there? I know caging it would be better but that is mega £££ for a cheap track day car!

Cheers

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1404476
17/01/2013 14:01
17/01/2013 14:01
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,114
FCSS 01684 593187
Countrycruising Offline
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Countrycruising  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,114
FCSS 01684 593187
Personally I've found one of the best additions you can have for your Coupe is a welded front subframe.
No need for lower braces or reduced ground clearance.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1404544
17/01/2013 18:08
17/01/2013 18:08
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Per Offline
I need some sleep
Per  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
The only worthwhile braces I think are:
front lower brace
front strutbrace
(these 2 unless you do the long route of welding subframe)
front longitudal braces (156/147 or GTV/Spider)
(not much but noticable)

The rear doesn't do anything.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1404547
17/01/2013 18:13
17/01/2013 18:13

J
jonone
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jonone
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J



I have the front 156 gta braces for sale wink

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: Per] #1404550
17/01/2013 18:17
17/01/2013 18:17
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Originally Posted By: Per
The only worthwhile braces I think are:
front lower brace
front strutbrace
(these 2 unless you do the long route of welding subframe)
front longitudal braces (156/147 or GTV/Spider)
(not much but noticable)

The rear doesn't do anything.


Per how much of a difference did you feel with the GTV longitudinal braces?

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1404769
18/01/2013 15:57
18/01/2013 15:57
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Per Offline
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On which scale? smile I think it was a tad more solid upfront afterwards, like I remember how the Sparco strutbrace felt. Then again it was off the road a few months inbetween so I really should take them off one day to really feel the difference. This summer!

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: Countrycruising] #1404792
18/01/2013 18:45
18/01/2013 18:45
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 684
Derby
E
Ecrab Offline
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Derby
Originally Posted By: Countrycruising
Personally I've found one of the best additions you can have for your Coupe is a welded front subframe.
No need for lower braces or reduced ground clearance.

How does the welded subframe compare to a lower strut brace. I had a lower brace fitted was very impressed with the improved stiffness, but removed it after a number of grounding issues

Last edited by Ecrab; 18/01/2013 18:46.
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1404799
18/01/2013 19:37
18/01/2013 19:37

J
jonone
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jonone
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J



as a side you wont get the ground clearance issues with the longitudinal braces.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405105
20/01/2013 11:42
20/01/2013 11:42
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,829
kidderminster
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kidderminster
How is the welding done??
From what I've read you need to weld the 2 "U" sections of the subframe either side... Marked in this pic I found....

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y165/bravo_rich/IMG086.jpg

But how is it done? Do you weld a brace "across" the sections marked??

Nick



368bhp @ 1.5 bar
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: Ecrab] #1405116
20/01/2013 12:03
20/01/2013 12:03
Joined: Sep 2006
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FCSS 01684 593187
Countrycruising Offline
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Originally Posted By: Per
On which scale? smile I think it was a tad more solid upfront afterwards, like I remember how the Sparco strutbrace felt. Then again it was off the road a few months inbetween so I really should take them off one day to really feel the difference. This summer!


Update me when you do this Per as it would be interesting to know the difference.

Originally Posted By: Ecrab
Originally Posted By: Countrycruising
Personally I've found one of the best additions you can have for your Coupe is a welded front subframe.
No need for lower braces or reduced ground clearance.

How does the welded subframe compare to a lower strut brace. I had a lower brace fitted was very impressed with the improved stiffness, but removed it after a number of grounding issues


I'll pm you smile

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405339
21/01/2013 07:40
21/01/2013 07:40
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
Stichl Offline
Making a profit
Stichl  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
In my experience as automotive engineer for decades I have learned one - If Alfa uses special braces, which cost some money, then these braces will have a "very good reason" for mounting them.
In negotiations my automotive company discusses about "cent" or "penny" - amounts for certain automotive parts.
Thus I reason, that these braces definitely will have some positive effect on stability of the complete frame of this car. Else Alfa would have saved some money and weight!
My conclusion: I use these braces in combination with a completely welded subframe...
Juergen


20VT coupegrale 4x4
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405375
21/01/2013 10:55
21/01/2013 10:55

J
jonone
Unregistered
jonone
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J



^^^ thumb ^^^

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405508
21/01/2013 20:30
21/01/2013 20:30

A
ActionHank
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ActionHank
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A



So where does one go about obtaining a set of these longitudinal braces. Can they be bought separately or is it a 'breakers yard' job?

Joe - seriously thought about getting you to weld my front subframe while my VT6 is up with you. That lower brace really does ground-out extremely easily!

Tom

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405536
21/01/2013 22:24
21/01/2013 22:24

T
Turboman87
Unregistered
Turboman87
Unregistered
T



I'm thinking off buying a front lower brace from Ultraracing. But don't know if its road legal, and if ground clearance is good enough for public roads??




Last edited by Turboman87; 21/01/2013 23:04.
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405538
21/01/2013 22:26
21/01/2013 22:26

J
jonone
Unregistered
jonone
Unregistered
J



Originally Posted By: ActionHank
So where does one go about obtaining a set of these longitudinal braces. Can they be bought separately or is it a 'breakers yard' job?

Joe - seriously thought about getting you to weld my front subframe while my VT6 is up with you. That lower brace really does ground-out extremely easily!

Tom


For sale section or pm wink

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405623
22/01/2013 12:50
22/01/2013 12:50
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,057
Southsea
G
Gunzi Offline
Club member 189, Former Club President
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Je suis un Coupé
G

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,057
Southsea
Originally Posted By: Turboman87
I'm thinking off buying a front lower brace from Ultraracing. But don't know if its road legal, and if ground clearance is good enough for public roads??


No idea about legality in the Netherlands however it doesn't leave a lot of clearance. I have a 156 lower brace and my car is lowered on eibachs. I have about 4 - 5cm ground clearance. It doesn't take much road camber to ground the brace. Pot holes are a no-no and speed bumps have to be taken at 10 mph MAX.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405633
22/01/2013 13:41
22/01/2013 13:41

A
ActionHank
Unregistered
ActionHank
Unregistered
A



I haven't put many miles on mine with the lower brace fitted. It is mainly b-roads around here though, so we'll see how it goes. If it becomes too much of a ball-ache I may well reconsider things.
Hopefully the weather will sort itself out soon so I can pick my coop up from FCSS!

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405685
22/01/2013 19:48
22/01/2013 19:48

T
Turboman87
Unregistered
Turboman87
Unregistered
T



Thanks for info lads. I am going to buy front lower brace. I have standard suspension/springs. I think my ground clearance will be like 7-8 cm. That is acceptable to me. I guess its legal but i dont care because it makes,car safer no mather what laws.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1405770
23/01/2013 01:58
23/01/2013 01:58
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Per Offline
I need some sleep
Per  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
You can put the lower brace on as it is and get worse ground clearance, but you can also adjust the shape of it relatively easy to get it up a bit.
For example the mounting points can easily be cut ca 15mm and welded back together, depending on what downpipe you have etc. Mine is also moved a bit forward to clear the sump plug.

For all the benefits of a seamwelded subframe, you can never fully match the stiffness of a cross brace... My 5 cents! smile

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1406660
27/01/2013 07:58
27/01/2013 07:58
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
Stichl Offline
Making a profit
Stichl  Offline
Making a profit

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
See enclosed pics regarding braces. It is not really much effort to mount them...

https://mc.gmx.net/guest?path=10-07%20vo...&viewType=1

And please do NOT forget to press the green button
"GMX Mediacenter Gastzugang"

Ps: @Per: Thank you for this really good idea!!!

Juergen


20VT coupegrale 4x4
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1406686
27/01/2013 12:21
27/01/2013 12:21
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,706
Gone
J
Jimbo Offline
Je suis un Coupé
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J

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,706
Gone
Link doesn't work Stichl, it just comes up with a warning page?

Have you tried photobucket, a lot less hassle than that gtx site.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1406737
27/01/2013 18:33
27/01/2013 18:33
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
Stichl Offline
Making a profit
Stichl  Offline
Making a profit

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 286
Germany
Edited, now it should work:

See enclosed pics regarding braces. It is not really much effort to mount them...

https://mc.gmx.net/guest?path=10-07%20von%20Stichl%40gmx.de&token=D00CAE3709E7B828&mandant=01&locale=de&viewType=1

And please do NOT forget to press the green button
"GMX Mediacenter Gastzugang"

Ps: @Per: Thank you for this really good idea!!!

Juergen


20VT coupegrale 4x4
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1406748
27/01/2013 19:18
27/01/2013 19:18

T
Turboman87
Unregistered
Turboman87
Unregistered
T



Very good idea Per!

Front lower brace will be installed next weekend I think.

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1406774
27/01/2013 21:31
27/01/2013 21:31
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Per Offline
I need some sleep
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Sweden
Hehe thanks, I did feel like a clever lad when I found this out.

teacher laugh

Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1410017
09/02/2013 21:31
09/02/2013 21:31

T
Turboman87
Unregistered
Turboman87
Unregistered
T



The front lower brace is installed. It wasn't necessary to cut the mount to get more ground clearance. Sorry Per smile

I have original suspension and springs. And I didn't hit any speed bumps. So on the practical side I'm not dissapointed. Also it improves the handling and stiffness of the subframe a lot. The issue I experienced is almost gone. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction. I didnt know at first there was a front lower brace!

Last edited by Turboman87; 09/02/2013 21:33.
Re: Suspension/Body Braces [Re: ] #1411035
14/02/2013 23:52
14/02/2013 23:52
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Per Offline
I need some sleep
Per  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,034
Sweden
Great read! Well done! smile


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