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Bike Chain Wear #1411309
16/02/2013 15:58
16/02/2013 15:58
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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I presume this one's past its best now the middle bits are floating around, but how do you tell when you should replace a chain? I've heard the gauges always show too much stretch?

click to enlarge

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411311
16/02/2013 16:04
16/02/2013 16:04
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Cambridge & Cotswolds
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MeanRedSpider Offline
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Yup - that's knackered

Chains aren't too expensive - I bought a Shimano Dura-Ace one recently (one of the lightest and best about) and it was under £30

A worn chain will wear out the more expensive bits so don't leave it too long

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: MeanRedSpider] #1411346
16/02/2013 19:06
16/02/2013 19:06

R
RobShed
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KMC make chains for Shimano.
Best advice is buying a middling SRAM or KMC and change at least twice/perhaps three times a year.
This promotes better service life of more expensive components like cassette and chainrings whilst also ensuring continually smooth running.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411347
16/02/2013 19:13
16/02/2013 19:13
Joined: Feb 2007
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West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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There seems to be so much discounting on Shimano that it works out cheaper than KMC at the moment on the 9 speed systems.

I can get Dura Ace / XTR for £19
Ultegra HG93 for £16
Deore HG53 for £10

I'm quite tempted to go for one of the better chains if it will last longer than the old HG53.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411588
18/02/2013 11:41
18/02/2013 11:41
Joined: Feb 2007
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West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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If a less worn chain is jumping around the rear cassette is that a sign that the cassette is a bit too far gone?

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411618
18/02/2013 14:48
18/02/2013 14:48
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,789
In the driving seat!
Guzbod Offline
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In the driving seat!
I would change my chain every year or twice a year if I was doing a lot of miles


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Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411620
18/02/2013 15:04
18/02/2013 15:04
Joined: Dec 2005
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Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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Originally Posted By: skinflint
If a less worn chain is jumping around the rear cassette is that a sign that the cassette is a bit too far gone?

Yes, putting a newer chain on a worn block will soon show it up. Just not worth scrimping on chain replacemnet or cleaning. Best way is to run three chains in rotation swaping over every 500 miles or so or whne they have got filthy. Adding oil to a dirty chain is counterproductive.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411627
18/02/2013 15:53
18/02/2013 15:53
Joined: Mar 2006
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Cambridge & Cotswolds
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MeanRedSpider Offline
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Careful though. The economics of chain cleaning sometimes get out of hand too. As noted above, chains aren't too expensive. Nor are cassettes (105 can be had for £30). Proprietory chain cleaner is (relatively) though. So keep chain cleaning in perspective (unless, of course, you're running something exotic). My bikes take loads of abuse as I commute in all weathers on some crappy, muddy, salty country lanes and I often get no chance to clean them during the week. I've had no issues though and I change my chain about once a year.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411633
18/02/2013 16:12
18/02/2013 16:12
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,522
Berlin
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Given that I ride once a week for a few tens of miles at best when it's warm and the sun is shining, my policy of ignoring it is looking ok, then?


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Don't get no respect! Coupe Fiat 1994-2000 - an owner's guide <-- clicky!
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411695
18/02/2013 20:57
18/02/2013 20:57
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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I reckon you're getting double the mileage by buying better quality parts MRS so they probably pay their way.

I've ordered a new cassette now so they can go on together.

One quick question on the chain cleaning - can you keep on extracting/ reusing the same link on a 9 speed chain?

Can you do the same with a 10 speed stretch to seat chain or do you need to buy a spare link?

What oil do you soak the chain in once it is clean? I've been using gearbox oil up to now.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411713
18/02/2013 22:39
18/02/2013 22:39
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,070
Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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Get a kmc missing link then you can split the chain at will. Lighter oil gently cleaned off with clean rags is best. Run the chain through the rag after each ride is the best routine in winter.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Mobile/MobileModels.aspx?ModelID=25439

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411746
19/02/2013 08:46
19/02/2013 08:46
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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Thanks!
That missing link would be a good spare to have in with the puncture repair kit too.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411747
19/02/2013 08:56
19/02/2013 08:56
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,385
Lightwater, Surrey
DaveG Offline
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What's wrong with using a normal chain link extractor (the one that forces out a pin to split the chain, then pushes it back in again to close)? And how do you manage to extract the same pin each time when they are all the same (at least I think they are on my chains?)

Is there any need to buy "missing links"? How does the missing link work? Do you need any special tool to get it apart?

Please educate me, I am still a bike novice frown


1996 Portofino 20vt & 2000 Pearl White Plus
1985½ & 2016 2017 Fiat 124 Spider + XF Sportbrake
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411752
19/02/2013 10:05
19/02/2013 10:05
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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What's all this "novice" stuff Dave? laugh

The 10 speed chains have a different system. 9 speed use a link extractor, 10 speeds have a "missing link".

I think on my 9 speed chain, one of the links is a bit different - it has a flat end and looks black where the others are silver.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411755
19/02/2013 10:20
19/02/2013 10:20

R
rhodri
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Urgh.. as soon as I read this thread I had a quick look at my chain and noticed some surface rust forming on it. I've taken good care of it - cleaning and lubing often but then left it in the shed outside for a week with no use and now the rust has formed. is it worth cleaning or just replace it? noticed mine has a master link to remove it and it's on an 8 speed system. ps - thanks for cassette info skinflint

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411757
19/02/2013 10:30
19/02/2013 10:30
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,289
Malvern
coupe_integrale Offline
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Surface rust - just give it a quick clean, chuck some lube on it and carry on.

It'll free up any stuff links as it goes round, don't worry about it.


Fiat Coupe Integrale
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: DaveG] #1411764
19/02/2013 11:51
19/02/2013 11:51
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,070
Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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Originally Posted By: DaveG
What's wrong with using a normal chain link extractor (the one that forces out a pin to split the chain, then pushes it back in again to close)? And how do you manage to extract the same pin each time when they are all the same (at least I think they are on my chains?)

Is there any need to buy "missing links"? How does the missing link work? Do you need any special tool to get it apart?

Please educate me, I am still a bike novice frown


Normal chain extractors were fine in that days of 7 and 8 speed chains but with later 9sp and above the chains came with expensive single use pins and it was not adviseable to split oyur chain more than once. 11spd campag chains require a £100 tool to connect the chain! I have had a 10 speed chain break on me when i tried the DIY pin extractor i used to use so won't do that again. The KMC missing link can easily be broken by hand, and the Wipperman Connex link is even easier. You must use a new one when you replace the chain but both those manufactureres sell the links with new chains anyway. I use a chanin splitting tool to remove excess links from a new chain but would never use it to re-connect a chain unless is was an emergency.

As skinflint says i have a spare missing link in my saddle bag in case or a chain breakage on the road.

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411777
19/02/2013 12:59
19/02/2013 12:59
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,385
Lightwater, Surrey
DaveG Offline
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So if I tell you that my only experience of chains relates to 5 speeds, you might be able to tell how old I am (or rather, how old the bike is)


1996 Portofino 20vt & 2000 Pearl White Plus
1985½ & 2016 2017 Fiat 124 Spider + XF Sportbrake
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411781
19/02/2013 13:25
19/02/2013 13:25
Joined: Dec 2005
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Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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Well i remember spliting chains on my 3 speed sturmey archer chopper. They just had a slide over link peice IIRC.

No doubt you can split and re-join old 5 speed chains countless times without issue. The bike must be at least 25yrs old

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: bockers] #1411782
19/02/2013 13:33
19/02/2013 13:33
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: bockers
Well I remember spliting chains on my chopper. They just had a slide over piece IIRC.

click to enlarge

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: bockers] #1411796
19/02/2013 14:49
19/02/2013 14:49
Joined: Mar 2006
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Cambridge & Cotswolds
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MeanRedSpider Offline
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Originally Posted By: bockers
The KMC missing link can easily be broken by hand,


Except the one I had! Even though it had broken, the bike shop had to use a tool on it.

Shimano tend to use pins (my 10-speed Dura-Ace one came with two - they aren't re-useable - but then many of the "quick link" systems are not meant to be re-used either). You can buy packs of pins if you want to regularly split the chain. I have no preference for any system though I do carry a spare quick link in case of a chain break

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411802
19/02/2013 15:36
19/02/2013 15:36
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,070
Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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KMC advertise their 10spd links as reusable but the 11speed ones as a use once only, which is not cheap at £4 per use!

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411922
20/02/2013 07:47
20/02/2013 07:47
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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skinflint  Offline OP
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I just had the first ride on the new chain and cassette.
Last time I went for the plain £10 HG53 9 speed chain and HG50 cassette and I couldn't really tell any difference. It definitely wasn't sweeter than the 105 setup on the Cayo, and was totally done in 2000 miles taking the cassette with it.

This time it is a Dura Ace / XTR 9 speed chain and the same Tiagra HG50 cassette and it is super smooth with none of the usual clattering from the rear cassette.

I think the conclusion would be that the HG53 9 speed chain might be a bit basic for everyday use.

I also just went over to genuine brake pads, and they've transformed the brakes so they no longer drag and bind on the discs.

It has been like riding a new bike today smile

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1411924
20/02/2013 07:52
20/02/2013 07:52

R
RobShed
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Gosh, you girls are getting so knowledgeable we should form a fully-fledged FC Race Team for MAMIL owners .. idea

TT,RR or wannabbees (sorry Sportif types) laugh

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: ] #1411926
20/02/2013 07:58
20/02/2013 07:58
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: RobShed
Gosh, you girls are getting so knowledgeable we should form a fully-fledged FC Race Team for MAMIL owners .. idea

TT,RR or wannabbees (sorry Sportif types) laugh


MAMIL's a new one on me biglaugh and why not?
It's a free country!

Do we need some kind of Caste system for commuters, Sportif saddos, proper TT ers etc?

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1412004
20/02/2013 13:32
20/02/2013 13:32

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RobShed
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Absolutely, the height at wish you can point percy adds weight wink
Sportif combatants wear nappies but are a good source of quality, used parts (that is 'till their near-endless supply of cash runs-out).
Bi an Tri types like legal drafting and as such are only fit for LVRC RR and occasional forays into testing.
Leaving ultimately, the truth test against the clock (see I'm not bias) laugh

Last edited by RobShed; 20/02/2013 13:32.
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1412024
20/02/2013 14:36
20/02/2013 14:36
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,385
Lightwater, Surrey
DaveG Offline
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I wonder if any of that makes sense to anyone else? My wife seemed pleased to call me a MAMIL until I pointed out that it was an old expression used before my current "renaissance" in cycling, and anyway I should be a GOGIL*





*grumpy old git in Lycra

Last edited by DaveG; 20/02/2013 14:38. Reason: press enter too soon

1996 Portofino 20vt & 2000 Pearl White Plus
1985½ & 2016 2017 Fiat 124 Spider + XF Sportbrake
Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: ] #1412035
20/02/2013 15:28
20/02/2013 15:28
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,275
West Berks
skinflint Offline OP
I need some sleep
skinflint  Offline OP
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West Berks
Originally Posted By: RobShed
Absolutely, the height at wish you can point percy adds weight wink
Sportif combatants wear nappies but are a good source of quality, used parts (that is 'till their near-endless supply of cash runs-out).
Bi an Tri types like legal drafting and as such are only fit for LVRC RR and occasional forays into testing.
Leaving ultimately, the truth test against the clock (see I'm not bias) laugh


I like your thoughts about the Sportif types - but how do you get the shiny parts off them?

Also where would a person who uses a bicycle to get from A to B fit in all this?

I think I'm a MLCISLBNAFC (Mid life crisis in some Lycra but not a full catsuit)

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1412036
20/02/2013 15:33
20/02/2013 15:33
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,603
Corridor of Uncertainty
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Jim_Clennell Offline
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When does Lycra become for comfort rather than speed...?

Re: Bike Chain Wear [Re: skinflint] #1412041
20/02/2013 16:06
20/02/2013 16:06
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,385
Lightwater, Surrey
DaveG Offline
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Lightwater, Surrey
When it's used like support tights.


Talking of which, I do admit to having a set of thermal long sleeved top and full length bib-style shorts (longs?), so almost a cat suit but not quite...

I think A to B commuters are so far down Rob's scale that he can't even see us frown (aha, but that's what I have my 1000+ lumen lights for laugh )


1996 Portofino 20vt & 2000 Pearl White Plus
1985½ & 2016 2017 Fiat 124 Spider + XF Sportbrake
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