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Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA #1671701
29/04/2024 19:41
29/04/2024 19:41
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
A short history of the vehicle:

I used to live in the UK until 2005 during which time I owned a 1997 Nuvola Blue 20VT.

http://www.tipo16v.co.uk/coupe/coupe.html

In 2005 I moved to Canada and took the car with me. I drove it around Alberta for 5 years and even went on a road trip down to Las Vegas. While in Canada I had the engine rebuilt twice. In 2011 I moved to the USA and put the FIAT into storage in Canada. I wasn't sure if I'd be staying in the USA and also the car wouldn't meet the DOT and EPA standards to import it.

Fast forward to 2023. I'm still living in the USA and the car is now 25 years old so no longer needs to meet the USA DOT and EPA standards. I found a shipper who would transport it down to the Houston where I live. I found a import specialist who filled out all the customs paperwork for me.

The car was shipped down to Houston in an enclosed container and arrived on 5th November 2023. I had hoped that a simple cambelt change and service would be enough. However when we checked the conditions of the pistons through the spark plug holes we noticed scoring and what looked like impact damage to #1 piston. I remember that when I put it into storage it had very low oil pressure and I was grateful it made it to the storage facility. My friend has a large workshop so I set about removing the engine and tearing it down. I discovered that the pistons were the wrong size for the bores and slapped from side to side. The bearings were also the wrong size and that is where I'd lost the oil pressure. The turbo bearing was also shot, probably from lack of oil pressure.

I took the engine to a reputable race engine builder here in Houston on 4th December called Faerman Racing Engines. The current pistons were the wrong size for the bore and rocked from side to side:

https://youtu.be/i6mfSnrKnfg?si=ybG-dFCjUQag7p6E

They said they could tell it had been re-bored already but it was okay for them to be taken from the current 83.5mm to 84mm. They have ordered another set of custom JE pistons. Unfortunately these will take between 6-8 weeks to be made.

The crank will be re-ground as well to the first undersized amount. They can get main and journal bearings locally at the correct sizes they need.

Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 29/04/2024 19:51.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1671702
29/04/2024 19:42
29/04/2024 19:42
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
Fast forward nearly 5 months and on 26th April 2024 the custom JE pistons have finally been made and delivered.

Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672633
28/06/2024 13:44
28/06/2024 13:44
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
I finally got around to taking the turbo GT3076R in to be rebuilt. The main bearing was worn due to the low oil pressure the engine had before it was put into storage. The turbo rebuilder also noticed the back of the turbine wheel was damaged, the front looked okay and I hadn't paid attention to the rear. This must have been from when the original engine suffered detonation and destroyed the ring lands of multiple pistons. Cost to rebuild about $650 - $750

Pictures show the current state of the car. It's nice and safe in the powder coating booth of my friend's workshop. Parts all over the place except the engine which is in multiple parts, some in my garage and some in the machine shop.

The machine shop are snowed under with work, a good sign, except they can't get around to my engine. My friend, who I trust 100% to do the work, is going to do it instead although he is also snowed under.

Yesterday I flushed the fuel lines with four cans of injector cleaner to remove any gunk built up from the old fuel. They were actually very clean as was the fuel I drained from the tank when the car first arrived. We expected it to be bad after 13 years in storage but other than the smell it looked okay but was disposed of regardless.

The bonnet struts have failed hence the 2x4 holding up the bonnet! New ones have been ordered. It's always good to have redundancy anyway.

Attached Files
20240627_180245.jpg (218 downloads)
20240627_172734.jpg (216 downloads)
20240627_172750.jpg (217 downloads)
20240627_172722.jpg (215 downloads)
20240627_172814.jpg (218 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 28/06/2024 14:50.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672634
28/06/2024 13:53
28/06/2024 13:53
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
The latest with the brake saga is that I have given up trying to source a rebuild kit for the Bendix. I ordered 3 different kits for a FIAT Coupe and they were all the same. I'm guessing they are for the LHD version. None of the seals would fit. I therefore ordered a LHD master brake cylinder. It arrived and it's a lot longer than the RHD stumpy Bendix one. I'm a bit nervous about clearance at the back of the engine but I won't know until I get the engine built. One issue is that the brake lines don't reach because the output from the master brake cylinder to the ABS unit is further away from the firewall. I made up a new brake line using the fittings from the original FIAT brake line. I was almost ready to cut it down to size when I thought it would be easier to swap over the parts such as the blanks and rubber feeds, off the car. This is when I noticed the next hiccup. The rubber grommets at the top where the brake fluid enters from the the reservoir are a different size! They are bigger on the LHD model so the plastic 90 degree bends off my RHD rubber hoses don't locate in place. I'm going to order the ones from the LHD (part number 7754186) to see if they fit. I only seem to be able to bring up the LHD model in EPER so I can't see if these plastic fittings are the same ones as the RHD model.

In the picture you can see the original RHD Bendix at the top with the tape measure (you'll need to rotate the image) the LHD Brembo at the bottom. The one in the middle is actually for a VW Transporter T4 (non ABS) that was suggested by someone who had swapped their 22.2mm LHD one for this one with 23.8mm pistons for more brake pressure.

More information below that you probably care about!.....

The FIAT master brake cylinder part number for RHD is 9948320 and for LHD is 9948315.

The RHD is a Bosch item 0204123623 / MC713 / EAN 3165143357507

Diameter is 22.22 mm

LHD Part number is used on following vehicles:
Alfa Romeo 145/146/155 GTV 916
Fiat Brava / o Type 182
Fiat Coupe Type 175
Lancia Delta

Delphi Technologies LM70195
MAPCO 1066
Metelli 05-0208
SAMKO P07442
TRW PMA199 / PMH584
CIFAM 202-208
ABE C9F019ABE
LPR 6771
ATE 24.2122-1716.3
Brembo M23020
FTE H22948.0.8
JURID 132256J
STARK SKMC-0570030

I ordered the Brembo one but they are probably all the same.

Attached Files
20240627_163745 - rot.jpg (215 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 28/06/2024 14:00.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672739
02/07/2024 18:47
02/07/2024 18:47
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Houston, Texas, USA
I found that the master brake cylinder for a VW Jetta 93-99 is also 22.2 mm (0.875 in) diameter and has the same fitting to the brake booster as the FIAT.

I went to the VW dealer and unfortunately all the models they looked up have the brake reservoir directly on top of the brake cylinder.

I went to a huge European/Japanese car dismantler and got access to their warehouse. I saw probably 100 feet of various master brake cylinders hanging up and they were either the type where the reservoir sits directly on the cylinder or had no hoses connected to take the plastic fitting off.

I could make a 3D model of what I want but I'm weary of the ABS or PLA plastic braking down when exposed to brake fluid. I guess I have time to leave something soaking in brake fluid to see what happens.

I checked with FIAT and the plastic parts for the Coupe LHD that I need are no longer available.

One option would be to try and find a LHD Coupe being broken for parts and get the plastic fittings off that. I think the best option for this would be to contact sellers on ebay selling Coupe parts.

I've attached a picture of the VW master brake cylinder. It's shorter than the FIAT one, which is good. The VW one is about 3cm longer and the LHD FIAT one is about 5cm longer than the RHD FIAT one.

I've also purchased a used FIAT Punto 99-06 master brake cylinder whose plastic fittings may work depending on what size they end up being!

John

Attached Files
Punto 99-06.png (182 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 02/07/2024 21:01.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673665
08/09/2024 03:13
08/09/2024 03:13
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
After some digging around in EPER I found some plastic connectors for the top of the master brake cylinder for a 1998 FIAT Bravo (FIAT part number 7658045). I found that these are still available and ordered a pair. When they arrived they were identical to those used on the LHD FIAT Coupe. I can now connect the master brake cylinder to the rubber brake hoses that connect it to the brake reservoir.

I ordered an aftermarket replacement master brake cylinder for a LHD FIAT Coupe (FIAT part number 9948315). This one was made by Brembo. As expected, the brake lines would not reach the fittings on the new brake cylinder. The fittings were further apart and at a different angle. I therefore had no choice other than remake the two brake lines that run from the master brake cylinder to the ABS unit. These are complex shapes and difficult to make due to requiring curves very close to where the ends need to be flared. The flare tool needs a certain length of straight tube to operate. It was also tricky to feed them down behind the ABS unit. This was a difficult to do with the engine out so I'm not sure this is going to be a viable solution for other owners.

The biggest unknown is whether the engine will clear the new brake cylinder given that it is 5cm longer. I won't know until the engine is built...

I'm hoping that next week the machine shop will schedule my bottom end to be built.

I picked up my rebuilt turbo. A GT3076. We didn't notice that after the first engine had detonation issues that it had damaged the backs of some of the turbine blades. A new turbine wheel and bearings have been fitted.

While the engine is out and I have easy access I've removed the steering rack. It's been leaking for a while from behind the RHS gaiter. I can't find a rebuild kit anywhere. I'm going to see if there is a shop in Houston that can rebuild it. If that doesn't work I've found a UK company on ebay (Steering Specialists Limited) that rebuild your steering rack after you ship it to them.

Attached Files
1000020723.jpg (147 downloads)
1000020715.jpg (149 downloads)
1000020710.jpg (146 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 08/09/2024 15:33.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673679
08/09/2024 15:24
08/09/2024 15:24
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
These pictures should give you a good idea as to how complex the brake line shapes are from the master brake cylinder to the ABS unit.

These are the original brake lines.

Note that in these pictures I've already cut off the fittings to use on the new brake lines.

Attached Files
20240907_152106.jpg (128 downloads)
20240907_152004.jpg (128 downloads)
20240907_151956.jpg (128 downloads)
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673681
08/09/2024 15:30
08/09/2024 15:30
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
These pictures show the two different plastic pipes that connect the rubber hose from the brake reservoir to the top of the master brake cylinder.

In the picture with two pipes and two plugs:

The original RHD plastic pipe is the black one. The outer diameter for the rubber plug is 14mm with a 7.5mm inner hole. The plastic pipe therefore has a 7.5mm diameter.

The original LHD plastic pipe is the white one. The outer diameter for the rubber plug is 19mm with a 13mm inner hole. The plastic pipe therefore has a 13mm diameter.

I'm using a LHD master brake cylinder which has 19mm holes in the top. I therefore couldn't use the black pipes that fitted into the RHD master brake cylinder because the diameter of the rubber plug (14mm) and pipe were too small. I have to use the LHD rubber plug (19mm) and white pipe.

In the picture with three pipes I'm showing the original white LHD plug at the top which is no longer available from FIAT. The middle white one is from a 1998 FIAT Bravo which is exactly the same and still available. The lower black one is from a 2003-2010 RHD Fiat Punto and is the same size. This would work as an alternative. The only real difference is that it has multiple barbs on the end that the rubber hose plugs into.

Attached Files
20240904_161308.jpg (124 downloads)
20240904_155401.jpg (124 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 08/09/2024 15:36.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673711
10/09/2024 20:05
10/09/2024 20:05
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Houston, Texas, USA
The bonnet gas struts had failed on my car. They were STABILUS 9895KX. These were difficult to find so I ordered some Magneti Marelli (FA175)11/93-08/00 ones which were supposed to be for the Coupe. However they would not hold the bonnet open. It would hold it open okay at about 25% open but any more and it would drop back down to 25%. The clips for the ball connectors were also a pain to use. They consisted of a little wire pin that inserted after it was seated home then clipped around the strut. This was very fiddly as you sometimes had the holes for the pin on the back side of the connection.

I ordered a pair of STABILUS 9895KX from WOX Parts Group and fitted them today. They work but if anything they are a little too strong. It takes quite a lot of strength to lower the bonnet to 25% then it closes easily.

Interestingly the Magneti Marelli are rated at 250N of force and the STABILUS is only 220N. They are both 673mm length and 276mm stroke

In the picture the Magneti Marelli strut is the silver one on the left and middle and the STABILUS one is the black one on the right.

Attached Files
gas.jpg (101 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 10/09/2024 20:24.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673945
26/09/2024 20:58
26/09/2024 20:58
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
The next issue was the steering rack!

The last time I had the engine out I noticed the steering rack was leaking. I never got around to ordering a replacement. I wish I had, because they are no longer available. One of the threads also stripped when bolting it to the subframe.

While the engine is out this time I had the threads professionally repaired using inserts. Not heli-coil style but a tube with a thread of both the inside and outside.

I found a place in the UK that would rebuild the steering rack. Unfortunately they don't want to deal with international shipping. I would have to ship it to my Mum and they would collect it from her then ship it back to her. My Mum would then ship it back to me.

I thought this was too much of a risk with 4 sets of shipping in either damaging or losing the rack.

I eventually found a place in Houston that would rebuild it for me. They rebuild Ferrari racks and specialize in steering components so they knew what they are doing.

I dropped the rack off on Monday and picked it up today, Thursday. It looks like new. They have replaced all seals and copper washers, cleaned and painted it, fitted new gaiters and tie rods. It wasn't cheap at $1300.

I also replaced the boots on the tie rods. Again, it's lots of fun not being in Europe! I could order the correct ones from eBay but with shipping they were $20 each. Amazon to the rescue! I ordered two collections of an assortment of 14 boots. Fortunately the seller included the sizes of every boot in the description so I knew one in each collection was the correct size.

Attached Files
1000021151.jpg (77 downloads)
1000021152.jpg (77 downloads)
20240912_141736.jpg (77 downloads)
20240912_135255.jpg (77 downloads)
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1673974
30/09/2024 01:25
30/09/2024 01:25
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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Houston, Texas, USA
The engine builder has a slot for me.

The first thing we've done is give the block a nice hot bath (hot tanking). This is a picture before the cleaning...

Attached Files
1000021175.jpg (63 downloads)
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1674121
14/10/2024 21:04
14/10/2024 21:04
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
Today we were able to bore the cylinders. Now we have to wait for the honing machine to become available.

The engine looks tiny compared to the V8 engine blocks they have!

Attached Files
20241014_142658.jpg (36 downloads)
20241014_142704.jpg (36 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 14/10/2024 21:06.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1674137
15/10/2024 22:52
15/10/2024 22:52
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline OP
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CanadianCoupe  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 47
Houston, Texas, USA
My braided front brakes have been rubbing against the metal frame of the car.
I'm going to replace these with standard rubber ones.
I'm not going to track the car so I don't need braided hoses. It was more about the looks for me.

I don't know why the images get rotated when I upload them. They look okay when I view them in Windows.

Attached Files
20241015_113036.jpg (20 downloads)
20241015_112925.jpg (20 downloads)
20241015_113001.jpg (20 downloads)
20241015_112724.jpg (20 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 15/10/2024 22:53.

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