My Coupé Project

well, now I know..

Thanks mate..

so what to choose, GSS340 or GSS341!!!

I've ordered the pump today.. it is GSS340 with the fitting kit from Flat4online delivered to me..

I hope it will fit easily and will be matching my above setup..

Any thoughts???

well, nothing new.. the engine will take about a month to arrive..

I received some parts and I thought to post some pics:

Defi Gauges Controller 1

Defi Gauges Controller 2

Defi Boost Gauge 1

Defi Boost Gauge 2

Defi Boost Gauge 3

Sparco Hand Brake

Sparco Gear Knob (Lift Reverse )

Sparco Pedal Set

NGK Spark Plug BKUR7ET 1

NGK Spark Plug BKUR7ET 2

ProAlloy Straight Induction Pipe

Samco Straight Coupling Hoses for Induction

APEXi Power Intake Filter

3" Adaptor for the APEXi Filter

APEXi Filter Part No.....

I ordered the 500-A022 by mistake.. it has a diameter of 75cm rather than the 500-A021 which is 80cm in daimeter..

I am not sure to keep it or order the larger one.. I am afraid of less air going into the GT28R although the difference is too small.. any thoughts??

ProAlloy Uprated Radiator

ProAlloy FMIC since December 2005

The fuel pump is on its way to me and expected to arrive within this week

The next step is the GT28R and the accessories.. and then the installation headache

cool hani,
all parts will be soo coool on the car

hope to see it again soon...

Edit : hani, you forget the H&S DP

Thanks Omran..

No.. I did not foget it.. I am considering it with the turbo and the acceossories..

Its been a long time.. Fiat agent has driven me crazy!!!!!!

Finally, the engine will be dispatched from Italy by 15-March-2007 by air freight.. I hope they are right this time..

hope to hani, just you dont have anything other than hope with them!

Guess what mates.. noting was dispatched on 15-March and they know nothing about status with Fiat Italy!!!!

I am really considering a modified engine from Torque Italia that will have: TI head with ported & polished, plus 3 angle seats, balanced OE rods & forged pistons and I already got the quote from Barbz.. price is almost the same of Fiat price but does not include the shipping which I will arrange for

Now confused what to do..

That would seem like a fairly straight forward choice?

Go Barbz..
Go Barbz..
Go Barbz..



This is my choice always mate

Hani,

I really don't see the point of discussing it.
Get the Barbz option ASAP and sod Fiat!
If prices are similar there is no comparison.
Shipping is an issue, but would be either way in your case

BTW, I know if a good company doing freight to Greece/Cyprus twice a week (trucks take 6 days to arrive to Cyprus I think)
If you have a cheap way of getting stuff from Cyprus I'd recommend them!

Thanks mates..

I think I will do stick to Barbz option..

I would like to see the faces of Fiat people when I cancel ordering their engine.. how bad is me..

Hani

You won't regret it. Torque Italia are the business.

Update..

Engine order is cancelled from Fiat and will go with Barbz modified engine.. I could not resist

Now, is it more benficial to have the GT28RS (0.64 A/R) rather than GT28R with the above modified engine .. I know the RS is more laggy than the R..

Hani

I guess it depends where you want your powerband to start and finish, I would imagine the RS will push your torque curve around 400 rpm to the right. There's also the RSR that Barbz does that is somewhere in between (RS Compressor, R Turbine).

Its been long time..

Here are some updates..

The exhaust system is shipped & available with me now: 3" H&S Downpipe , SuperSprint decat & 2.5" BlueFlame cat-back .

Engine wise, and after Barbz advisse, he is now considering forged rods to the engine specification above.. I think it is good to do it both once (forged pistons & rods) to avoid bending rods in case of future increase of power.. here some photos as received from Barbz :

Block

Piston Set - 1

Piston Set - 2

Hopefully, the engine will be ready by end of July and waiting the turbo (GT28RS, 0.64 A/R) & accessories purchase (depending on money off course ) the clutch will be Helix paddle.. the budget really gone over my abilities at the moment..

Also, I had to buy this one for daily use as I do not think I can use the coupe dail any more

Coupé paranoia

Hani

Nice one! Hang in there, it will be worth it when it's back.

hey hani,
i think you made the right choice by adding all these pits and wait for sometime. You will be very happy when you get it back

omran

Well, It's been a long time.. almost a year!!! It's really busy world and it's really hard to finish anything on time

I had a meeting with the nice Barbz in Dubai this week and discussed many stuff (he was so kind to answer my tons of questions )

Engine is being worked on and will be assembled soon in Dubai by Barbz.. hopefully it will be finished within August-September for my colection to be installed in Fiat dealer here

Initially, I was thinking to go with the GT2871R but decided to go for the GT28RS with 0.64 A/R to avoid changing the injectors and going into complicated mapping issues especially with the lack of experienced people in Qatar.. when I get the engine installed on thecar in here, I might take the car to Dubai for final touches by Barbz.

Expecting a solid 370hp @ 1.2-1.4 bar with my setup which will be enough for me as a begining. At least, I will have fully forged internals in the engine ready in case I decide to be mad and go for 500hp or above

Don't forget the cooling...

I've been thinking about the aquamist system for extra cooling.. might go for it when the engine/car is ready..

Anyway, it is not going to be a daily car so will not drive it a lot during our lovely hot weather

After Flea solution for the 440cc injectors to run with the standard ECU, I paaning to get the GT2871R with 0.64 A/R now instead of the GT28RS.. thanks god I did not buy the GT28RS earlier..

Now, I am planning to get the GT2871R from ATP Turbo, any one ordered his from them and got a list of the associated bits to get from them?

Thanks for the help..

It's been a while since the last update..

Barbz is putting the final touches on the engine and I called him this afternoon to stop him

I decided to get a new set of C&B cams for my engine to have a complete package and the maximum output of the engine.

I also wanted to avoid any future mess with the engine in future in case I were to install them later.. and save a belt service while installing them in future..

I posted a thread in the "Parts Wanted" forum. So, in case anyone have these.. it will be appreciated

I will have the cams sent to Barbz to finish the engine..

Ok... to consolidate above posts and update you all, I am listing my final components of my project:

Engine:
- Built 20VT engine by Torque Italia (Barbz) with below following specifications
- Standard block
- Standard crank, balanced and polished
- Forged pistons, by CP, 83mm, CR: 8.5:1
- Forged rods, by Cunningham
- Uprated head: ported & polished, 3 angle seats (I think this is stage 2 head)
- Colombo & Bariani (C&B) camshafts, intake timing: 10.2, exhaust timing: 9.4
- Spark plugs: NGK BKUR7ET

Tune (Engine Management) & Fuelling:
- Standard OEM ECU
- Stage 4 'FC Performance chip' from Flea
- Injectors: Bosch green giant injectors, 440cc
- Walbro fuel pump, 255lph with wiring mod
- Fuel pressure regulator: Bosch 3 bar or 3.8 bar
- Weber fuel rail

Induction & Turbo:
- APEXi cone type air filter, dry type
- Torque Italia 3” straight induction pipe (SIP)
- Big MAF housing
- Ported and matached intake manifold
- GT2871R with T25 turbine inlet, 5 stud turbine outlet, 0.86 A/R
- Associated accessories
- HKS SSQV V.2 blow off valve

Exhaust:
- Exhaust manifold: standard, ported and matched
- Downpipe: 3” H&S with 5 stud adaptor, fits to standard cat flange (2 bose for lambda probe and wideband AFR sensor)
- De-cat pipe: Supersprint, with standard cat inlet flange
- Cat-Back : 2.5” BlueFlame with back box and tail

Drive Train:
- Standard 20VT gear box, 5 speed with short shifter
- Helix paddle clutch with uprated cover plate
- Lightened standard flywheel

Cooling:
- Intercooler: ProAlloy with all piping and hoses
- Radiator: ProAlloy uprated, aluminum
- Water / methanol injection: either Aquamist or AEM system
- Oil cooler: standard, new

Electronics & Gauges:
- APEXi AVCR boost controller
- Defi gauges controller unit
- Defi boost gauge (-1 to +2 bar)
- Defi fuel pressure gauge (0 to +6 bar)
- Defi exhaust gas temperature (EGT) gauge (200 to 1,100 deg.C)
- AEM wideband air fuel ration (AFR)
- Brancle widget IV or V (depending on purchase time)

- Engine is being built by Barbz and ONLY waiting for C&B cams, I will get the C&B cams by end of January and send it to Barbz to close the engine

- The Coupè will not be my daily use car (I have a Mustang for my daily driving ). So I am working on the Coupè carefully and not in a rush to get it on roads.. unless totally completed and reliable. I hope to finish it within 2009

- Now, I started to think about the power output (horsepower and torque) from my Coupè when it hits the roads. I have the following issues to enquire about:

- I am still un-decided on the turbo; it is going to be GT2871R but which A/R: 0.64 or 0.86??? I know the 0.86 will push higher power at the tope end but I am afraid to be too laggy at the low end. How is it (the 0.86 A/R) expected to act with my head work, C&B cams and the 3” SIP?

- I mean, when can I see the boost kick and maximum boost? I think I can run upto 1.7 bar of boost on my engine.

- With above setup, am I going to join the 400hp club with this setup ??? And at what boost???

- The chip will be FC Performance Stage 5 from Flea. However, in absence of rolling road mapping services here, it will a trial and error and might involve sending the chip to Flea several times for modification on the map. I am really concerned on this issue.

- I will be getting the turbo from ATP Turbo by February (depending on cash), if anyone has bought his from them, please post the list of accessories (invoice copy) purchased for the turbo. I have a list and I need to compare so I don’t miss any part, overseas ordering and shipping sometimes becomes pain

- Any changes required on the GT2871R actuator and compressor housing orientation (like the GT28R ordered from ATP)

- AEM water / methanol injection system : any one tried this one on here??? Any thoughts???

Offcourse, I've discussed above issued with Barbz, but would like to hear from you mates as well for wider experience range

Many questions will come along the road, so be prepared mates

Ooooooops.. not a single reply

I think you should pay for Leighton to come over and map it properly

Hi hani
Top work you have waited a lot to lunch the beast.

Well, im sure that mates here would give you good recommendations on your requests, but I believe it will exceed the 400hp mark . I think 1.7bar is in this place of the world but you can consider it during nights

From what I saw here, i think you will not have any problems getting the “real kick” on 3300-3400rpm with the GT2871R & A/R: 0.64 and im expecting it to be just before the 4K mark if you have the A/R: 0.86. im sure someone could comment on this more than me, but this is from what I saw here. If I were you, I will get the 0.86 as you will be having the C&B cams and you don’t want low power at the top end.

Also I noticed that you are adding the FPR, so how do you want to fit this without live mapping? No way to get t right if you don’t have dyno. I know that you are going to get chip from Flea but the FPR will not be useful if you get a plug n play chip.

Anyway, hope you will get this soon on roads; you have spent a lot of time, effort & money to get it done and im sure you will enjoy it

That could be an option when the time comes





Regarding turbo, I see myself going to the GT2871R with 0.86 A/R.. hope the lag will be minor (I am not comparing to the OEM turbo).. from what I read, I can see full boost @ 4,000 RPM.. this will be fine with me as long as the power beyond 4,000 RPM will be

Hi Omran.. you posted while I was posting my earlier post Thanks for the comments..

You know the poor dyno we have here more than me Omran.. I think we shoul bring both Barbz and Leighton to here

yup,, with their tools & RR

Finally, I received the C&B cams yesterday. I got them from ACAR MILANO.. excellent service and recomended..

Here are couple of photos:

C&B Cams Boxes
C&B Cams Codes
C&B Cams

C&B Intake Cam - 1
C&B Intake Cam - 2

C&B Exhaust Cam - 1
C&B Exhaust Cam - 2

The cams will be going to Barbz as soon as possible to finish my engine

cool stuff hani
c'mon send it to barbz

Cams are already dispatched to Barbz this morning, it will be with him by tomorrow or the day after.

I will call him later to this week to check his plan for finishing the engine. Anyway, I am planning to visit Dubai early March so probably will bring the engine with me by then.. can't wait to put my hands on it

"Anyway, I am planning to visit Dubai early March so probably will bring the engine with me by then.. can't wait to put my hands on it"

Lol, it's a man thing...

Should be good to see how it goes when it's all together, Hani

Good project

hum... good work.. with your material at least the GT2871..

Nice little read. Keep up the good work.

@ feeblebob: thanks, I hope to see it together soon as well . I am expecting some cash this month so the build progress will be faster

@ leugim_21: thanks mate

@ Oracle: thanks, yeah it will GT2871R with 0.86 A/R which is the biggest turbo with internal wastegate setup (I think). Its amazing how I started my plan with GT28R, GT28RS and ended up with the GT2871R

@ RusH: yeah, it is a long and old thread . I thought to share my little project with everybody

I was looking at this GT3071R-WG Dual BB, 86AR, 90 Trim Turbine.

I didn't know that GT3071 fits the T25 exhaust manifold and comes with internal wastegate

I'm really thinking to get it but the only thing holding me is lag. I've carried a little search on the forum and have found similar setups but with different spool figures. (my setup is posted on 12-Jan-2009 above). Jari spool figures seems to be the best

I think I should buy the turbo as soon as possible before my mind keeps upgrading and I am afraid to find my self buying one of the GT40XX turbos

with smaller housing the 3071r spools 3000rpm / 1bar so
with bigger housing around 3400rpm-3500rpm / 1bar
those are from 2.0 16v engine..

What is the new weight of the flywheel?

awesome project !

@ jtm, well if it is the same with the 20vt, I think I can live with it. Seeing full boost by 4,000 rpm is also preferred but I'am note sure

@ Freddean72, I am not sure about the new flywheel weight . Lightening the flywheel is being done by Barbz before fixing it with the clutch and gearbox to the engine

@ Dilster, thanks

You are obsessed with weight.

Haha I just want to compare all the options that are out there

here you can see, with 3071r smaller housing..

http://s224.photobucket.com/albums/dd72/jq4tm/?action=view&current=200sxgt3071r64.jpg

Thanks jtm, nice power curve

its a 200 sx en it???

Nick

yes that was Nissan 200sx s14, with 3" exhaust, china exhaust manifold, walbro, fmic, and gt3071r smaller one.
boost 1.55bar. after that dyno, car owner take the turbo out
and make the wastegate hole larger, chance plugs,
and make a new chip = 404hp, same boost..
I have dynopaper that run also...

I've asked Barbz about this Freddan72

He usually removes about 2kg of the flywheel weight. I think the original weight of the flywheel is 9kg.





Update: it seems I am going for the GT3071R with 0.86 A/R turbine housing.. I think this is going to put me in the 400hp club with my setup

450bhp more like.

I hope so paddy...

looks like its coming along nicely Hani!!

cant wait to see some clips of it on the you tube!

Thanks Marco.. it's getting closer and closer

Will post some clips of the car on YouTube.. some race videos as well

Okay. The original one weigh 9.4 kg. So yours is now 7.4 kg. I hope you feel a difference when it's time for a testdrive

Do you know how much the clutch weigh?

hey hani

seems that GT3071R with 0.86 A/R turbine is the way to go, but just keep in mind that there is a difference between the actual kick and the max boost.

i dont believe that you will face huge lad with the cams and the lightened flywheel. go a head a do it,,,,

hang on mate, about to be ready, so close

@ Freddan72: I hope to feel the difference. I think the engine rev will be more smooth.

As for the clutch weight:
Standard: (will check once the ePER is working again)
Helix Paddle (which I will have on my car): around 7kg with the coverplate

@ Omran: I have until end of month to decide on the turbo so will do more read and research until then

However, from what I read, the GT3071 with 0.86 A/R turbine housing will give 1bar at 3,500rpm and full boost (1.5-1.7 bar) by 4,200rpm.. I think I can live with this.. we'll see how it goes..

I have the C&B cams, head work, lightened flywheel and the 3" SIP.. all to reduce lag




Another question now.. are the 440cc injectors going to be enough with the GT3071R or shall I upgrade these as well??? I'll have the Walbro 255lph as well

hani your project is growing like nothing!!

I think the original clutch kit weigh 6.3 kg.
GTA weigh 4.9 kg. So just by changing clutch kit you save 1.4 kg

Ok.. after reading more and more on the GT3071R turbo, it seems to have two major issues: compressor surge and overboosting sometimes

Users of GT3071R, please comment

Are you going for the internally or externally gated version?

If I am going for the GT3071R, it will the internally gated version, with 0.86 A/R turbine housing.

You definately shouldn't get any surge, boost creep may happen if tyring to run very low boost. As said in our pm, I also think you should go for the 0.64 housing.

Thanks Leighton

My idea was to get the 0.86 housing in order not to regret loosing top end power, keeping in mind that spool between the 0.64 & 0.86 housings is only 300-400RPM.

Forgive my question, can you describe boost creep feeling? and what is low boost, 1.2bar for expample???

The spool between the housings is 500rpm, you will make 1bar around 3700-3800rpm and full boost around 4200-4300rpm. As long as you can live with that then go for it, it will certainly make the job of getting 400bhp easier.

Re boost creep, it is simply where the boost keeps rising despite the wastegate being fully open i.e. it is too small to vent enough exhaust. This is not a problem at moderate to high boost, but you may find at low boost i.e. 1bar, it will rise to 1.2bar by redline regardless.

sorry to jump in this thread but what would the difference (rpm wise) be between a 48ar and 63ar???
Less than 500 rpm i'd guess??

Nick

The only thing I don't like about the internally gated version is that it doesn't actually use the gt30 exhaust turbine - to get the room required for the gate it actually uses a smaller turbine

I did a fair amount of research into it, a guy "discopotato03" who seems to know a fair bit about turbos wrote a good post on honda-tech and posts alot on Skyline websites, and he seems to know his stuff - most of the way down page 2 (just look for discopotato03 post) about the gt3071r, gt3076R and gt3082R - the WG gt3071R use a ground down turbine at 56.6mm rather than the 60mm of the gt30, which he doesn't rate.

http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=1545133&page=2

Thanks Flea and Saint

Will decide by end of month when the turbo purchase time comes..




Users of GT3071R are still welcome to comment

I got my wastegate ported on the GT3071R to try and eliminate any boost creep! Not yet up and running so can't comment further I'm afraid!

Thanks eldinho

Let me know when run it on the car.

By the way, which waste actuator are you going to use? I gues it is this one: GT28RS Wastegate Actuator



Anyway, to avoid the boost creep, solution is to use high boost all the time

Hi Hani,

Yes, I recommend you 0.86 housing .

I can see 1 bar boost with 5th gear already on 3300 rpm and full adjusted boost just before 4000 rpm.


-Jari-

Jari you are most definately the exception to this rule!! I have driven a lot of coupes now and I can't for the life of me find one that comes on that quick with a 0.86 housing. Do you have your latest graph to hand as that will give Hani an idea of torque figures across the rpm range?

Thanks Jari

As I said earlier, your spool figures seem to be the best among the GT3071R users. It must be the Finnish air as everybody said earlier

As Flea suggested, if you can post your latest graph it will be appreciated.

Okay, here you have .

Latest RR form one year ago:
http://s128.photobucket.com/albums/p199/GT3071R-WG/?action=view&current=410bhp.jpg

And the reason for sudden power drop:
http://s128.photobucket.com/albums/p199/GT3071R-WG/?action=view&current=IMGP2282.jpg
and
http://s128.photobucket.com/albums/p199/GT3071R-WG/?action=view&current=IMGP2289.jpg

Rev limiter is in 7300 rpm, what could have been seen there...

-Jari-

Jari any graph of torque or boost?

Thanks Jari

Did you have the C&B cams installed during this RR?

Nice power curve you got between 4,000 and 6,000 RPM

Hi,

Freddan, torque curve is seen on the print. I suppose you mean A/F and boost . They have been taken on video together with Apexi AVC-R rpm. Through that I can see the mixture and boost in every rpm I like.
The peak power was achieved with 1.32 bar.

Hani, C&B cams were installed half a year before this RR session.
I told you, that I can recommend the bigger housing... .
And the truth of boost behaviour on street is an other story.. .

-Jari-

Yes AFR & boost. Sorry, it's Friday

Ok.. finally made up my mind.

I'm going for the GT2871R rather than the GT3071R at this stage. I'm afraid if I get the GT3071R it will be too laggy and I feel it is a big jump right now. However, the GT3071R might be an option in the future, I try the GT2871R first and I hope to see full boost before 4,000RPM

I'll be getting the turbo from "ATP Turbo" in a couple of weeks but wanted to make sure of the associated bit and pieces to get with the turbo.

I have the following list:

GT2871R Turbo - 56 Wheel Trim - 0.86A/R Turbine Housing - 5-Bolt Turbine Discharge

Oil Drain Flange

Oil Return Gasket

Oil Drain Fitting

Banjo Fitting Kit for Coolant Lines

T25/GT25 Turbo Exhaust Side Inlet Gasket

5-Bolt Turbine Discharge Gasket

I appreciate if anyone can confirm if the list is correct and advise if I need to add any other parts . It is hard to order parts overseas everyday so I want my list to be correct so I can order everything at once.

I will get these from "ATP Turbo" as well

HKS V2.0 SSQV Blow off Valve

Aluminum Adapter (size: 1") for Blow off Valve

APEXi AVCR Boost Controller



Ohhh.. and yes, I'm waiting Barbz to call me anytime (this week or next week) to collect my engine from him

woo hoo!!

so nearly there Hani!!

not long now!

Yeah Marco, getting closer and closer

I appreciate if anyone can confirm if the above list from "ATP Turbo" is correct and advise if I need to add any other parts. People who bought the GT2871R from ATP Turbo are welcome to comment

It is hard to order parts overseas everyday so I want my list to be correct so I can order everything at once.

This is the same turbo I am running, but bought a V-band T3 housing from ATP for it, so I can run it with external gate

But I will be running the internal wastegate one

What about the other parts (especially oil and water fittings).. are they ok? or do I need to add any other thing???

Ok.. an update

I received the turbo and some parts from ATP today:

GT2871R - 0.86 A/R - 56 Trim

Heat Sheild (I hope it fits in the Coupe)

HKS SSQV Blow off Valve

As for the engine, Barbz was about to fix the cam cover when he discovered a crack on it so he had to alloy weld it. It is done now and I shall arrange to collect the engine from Dubai.

I can't wait anymore

Good news Hani

Your project is finally very similar to mine

The only difference is i have bought 9:1 CR pistons and GT3071R-WG 0.64.

Otherwise everything is similar : ported + matched manifolds, headwork stage 2, 3" H&S DP, 440cc Giant Green injectors, etc...

I'm waiting for your future RR... this will be a good example of what power i'm going to make

Let us know

very similar spec to mine Minipit! should have results in about 2 months hopefully

That's a good news!

Are you going to run C&B cams like Hani?

yes, had them before the rebuild

Ok mate

Not to hijack Hani's topic i will send you a pm tomorrow... i have some questions about these cams

It seems that this setup is well preferred by many Coupe owners

I was about to get the GT3071R but it will be an option in future if I don't get what I need with the GT2871R

I'll let you mates know the figures when the car comes back to life.

Finally, I received the engine on Thursday.. I delivered it to Fiat agent on today and took some photos:

Engine - 1

Engine - 2

Engine - 3

Engine - 4

Barbz was so kind and he has built the engine as much as possible and he provided with additional parts like:

Big MAF Housing

Weber Fuel Rail

Ported & Matched Intake Manifold

And he surprised by painting the rocker cover in matt black and providing the red spark plug cover (it was missing from my rocker cover that I sent to him). I would like really to thank him.

Now, I'm discussing the plan of waking up my dead Coupé with Fiat agent. The Coupé has been there since 08-Dec-2004 and I'm wish to put it back on streets very soon

I'm just waiting for the APEXi AVC-R boost controller, the other Defi gauges (fuel pressure and the exhaust gas temperature) and the AEM wide band AFR gauge, I'm expecting these tomorrow.

More updates to follow!

hani,,,,

great news mate,,,i would love to see it soon to smash some of the chaps here

the engine looks great and Barbz have really done agreat job...good luck mate and i hope to sit next to you soon

Thanks Omran. Hopefully, you will be the 1st to take a ride in it

Today, I received the blanace parts:

APEXi AVC-R Boost Controller

Defi gauges set is complete now

AEM Wideband AFR Gaugae

And this photo describes how carazy I'm these days: Coupé Cosmetics . I prepared everything to be taken to Fiat garage tomorrow and they will start immediately with the works.

Many questions will arise these days.. so be prepared mates

Good news Hani!

I like your project and i'm sure everything will be ok

Keep us informed

Thanks MiniPit.. I'll keep you all informed. Keep us informed about yours as well.

We both have very similar setup and we need to compare the turbo choice: me wit the GT2871R and you with the GT3071R

No problem Hani

I will finish my coop in the end of this Summer if everything is ok.

My GT is just a little bigger (same compressor but 56.5mm turbine vs 53 for you) so i'm sure the difference won't be huge

I will keep you informed of my project and watch closely yours

Good luck Hani!

good one hani and i like the Coupé Cosmetics pic

Fast question:

I'll be installing the Defi EGT gauge and I need to drill a hole in the exhaust manifold as per the following sketches:

EGT Sensor Connection

EGT Sensor Fitting

For people who used / are using a Defi EGT gauge, can you post a photo of the exhaust manifold showing the sensor fitting?

Just want to make sure I do it correctly and I need to do it as soon as possible before the garage fits the turbo.

Awaiting you mates

Hani, here's an interesting idea you might to consider when finding a place to install those gauges.


IMHO it looks the part, much better that those racey-boy-a-pillar ones .

Hani, don't drill a hole like on your picture. This will only show you EGT from one cylinder

The best place to fit it is inside the plate where the 5 pipes come close. Hard job because it's a thicker place but it's possible.

But i don't know if the Defi sensor will be fair-sized

Mine is from plx-devices and it's ok.

I'm going to search on the French Forum for some pics and i'll post them

I've found the pic

Taken from the 20VT of my friend :

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6964/collecteurt202.jpg

@ Alesi.. thanks for the photo and the suggestion.. it is really a nice idea

@ MiniPit.. many thanks the photo . Good point but I think the temperature difference between cylinders will be marginal.

Anyway, here are tow photos of the sensor and the fitting:

EGT Gauge Sensor & Fitting - 1

EGT Gauge Sensor & Fitting - 2

Barbz suggested to locate the sensor on the 5th exhaust manifold pipe which is almost similar to the photo you posted, will see how it goes.

You're right. The difference is marginal. And if Barbz said it's ok on the 5th pipe you can do it

How much Celsius degree Barbz advice you to not go past?

Well, I didn't ask Barbz about expected EGTs yet. From what I know / read, the EGT will be in the range of 750-950 deg.C (depending on boost, cruising, pushing it hard,...)

Also, nowadays, we have temperatures of 50 deg.C by noon time so Auqmist is a must

50°c

Ok... i understand now why you really need aquamist

I will not be using the car in that time of course, summer is really bad here.. hot and humid

Ok.. its been almost 4 weeks since I delivered the engine to Fiat, they did nothing for 3.5 weeks!!!

I pushed them last week and for the last 4 days, this is what they have done:









They fitted the gearbox and all ancilaries to the engine . I told them to fit a new oil cooler and pipes but I was surprised when I saw the old one fitted (the old one is knackered + its been sitting collecting dust for the last 4.5 years). I told them to replace the cooler and pipes with brand new ones.

Turbo is going in tomorrow

They tested the starter and the alternator they are ok to use (I bought them only a month before the car stopped 4.5 years back)

I requested them to make a port for the EGT gauge sensor and they did a good job :

EGT boss

EGT boss with plug (the plug will be uused in case I cancel the EGT gauge)

EGT gauge fitting

I'm not intending to use the heat sheild but the technician told me this will heat up the radiator. I will fit the turbine housing sheild but heat will still come from the exhaust manifold so wrapping might help.

I have some questions :

For the people who are using the GT2871R, have you had to rotate the compressor housing to fit in the Coupe? I am asking because I tried (with the technician) to fit the turbo but the compressor outlet will be pointing at the oil pan insted of pointing at the radiator side (as it should be). I remeber the housing rotation process was required only for the GT28RS

Is there any possibility to find this turbo inlet oil pipe new and from where? Fiat agent here does not have it and I dont want to use the old one.

Hani: Contact John Snijders from CentroStileParts john.snijders@centrostileparts.com in the Netherlands, he will be able to deliver, no doubts.

good stuff hani,, you have to be on top of their head to complete this project otherwise they will not care...

AFAIK, you have to rotate the compressor housing to fit. i remember reading this somewhere here.

anyway, good luck mate and keep up..

@ Alesi: thanks for the advise. I dropped John an e-mail and I hope to get a reply from him soon.

@ Omran: thanks.. I will be pushing them a lot in the next few days. I have 21 days holiday as you know so I'll be their pain for the upcoming period

I'll use the standard turbo oreientation as a guid to rotate the compressor housing of the GT2871, it should be facing the floor.

Finally, the turbo (GT2871R) is in. I think they've done a good job, Here are some photos :

Turbo - 1

Turbo - 2

Turbo - 3

Turbo - 4

Now, they need to paint the engine bay before fitting the engine but their body workshop is busy at the moment and will take them a week to start with my car

Here are some bad news, Fiat agent told me that they will not fit the APEXi AVC-R boost controller because they think it is a complicated job! so I need to fit it outside when I take the car. In order to run the car for the first time, is it ok to fit the standard EBV or shall I fit a manual boost controller? I'm supposed to run with the standard ECU chip and base boost during the engine break-in period before I move to FC Peformance stage 5 chip from Flea

good, good, good project...

Good news Hani. Like you already know i like your project



That's what i plan to do with mine too

Running "slowly" with my actual own eprom and standard injectors during the time needed to break-in. Inch by inch i will increase the RPM and the boost until the boost applied requires bigger injectors. From that moment it will be time for BIG POWER

I think you can do like that. If we are wrong, just let us know guys how to do better.

@ Oracle, thanks mate

@ MiniPit, thanks mate, I'm waiting for your project as well

If this is the case, I'll be running the standard EBV. But here comes the question, the EBV has 3 hoses as per this diagram:



1 hose from the EBV to the turbo wastegate actuator
1 hose from the EBV to the turbo compressor housing
1 hose from the EBV to the SIP

Now, the 3" SIP that I have doesn't have any hole and the GT2871R doesn't have any hole in the compressor side (like the standard turbo) so I'll end up wit one hose connected to the wastegate actuator. Does this seem correct and will it be running on base boost like this? any thoughts mates?

I'm concerned because the people who are fitting the engine (Fiat agent) is not familiar with these tuning issues they only work by the book

Just join the compressor and wastegate pipes together and leave the ebv plugged in. You'll then just run off actuator pressure.

The Apexi is easy enough to install.

Thanks Flea. So if I do this, the boost will 14psi which is the actuator pressue

I know that the APEXi is easy to install, but these people are killing me I have to talk to their electrician again and convince him to install it for me

Yes. Between 12 and 14 psi (IIRC) depending on how it is adjusted

(You can change the hardness playing with the nut which is on the rod)

Thanks MiniPit




I'm still confused a little bit and I want to confirm this with Fiat garage tomorow as I will be travelling for 2 weeks and expect them to fit and run the engine during my leave

Now and looking at below skectch, I presume the connections will be as follows:

- The EBV will be connected to the ECU only (not shown below)
- Hoses 3 and 4 will be connected to each other
- Hose 7 will not be used



Can anyone confirm above connections in order to run with base boost?




Also, this means that I should have a bose in the compressor housing of the GT2871R. Unfortunately, it doesn't have. I found this interesting QuickTap in ATP which will save me the drilling of the compressor housing. I think I should get it, it will look like this:

You're right Hani

If you disconnect hose 7 from the EBV don't forget to block it with a little plug

About the Quicktap, that's what i've bought for my GT30. I don't have the connection on the compressor housing too. I was affraid by air leak with this system but ATP told me lot of people run this Quicktap and there is no problem with it.

I run a quick-tap with my 28rs and its fine

Ben

@ MiniPit, thanks for confirming the EBV connections and your input on the quicktap

@ Benny, thanks for your input on the quicktap

I'm travelling tomorrow for 2 weeks vacation. More updates when I come back

I run with the same turbo (GT2871R), but my turbine housing is a T3 A/R .63, externally wastegated.

Congrats for you project, but as someone who suffered a LOT of issues and bugs during the process of 'make things happen', i'd like to leave a conseil to you:

I think your oil return hose - like I see on the pics above, is obstructed. You can solve this by moving and untighten the CHRA bolts, positioning the return hose at a straight and smooth line to the crankcase plug.

My wishes of success!

Weiler

Thanks Weiler for your wishes and the note on the oil return pipe, I'll see what we can do about it

Got back from vacation and visited Fiat workshop.

They have fitted the engine and the fuel pump but without the wiring mod.

Now, they are working on fitting the other parts: radiator, intercooler, exhaust system, etc.

Here are some photos of the engine bay:

Engine - 1

Engine - 2

Engine - 3

Not a neat job, I know. We have a dusty weather and it is useless to clean everything now as it will get dusty agin once it is on the roads. However, I'll give a polish job for the engine once all works are finished.

More updates later this week

Update:

intercooler, radiator, dump valve, exhaust are all fitted to the car and it is almost ready to run.

Some photos:

ProAlloy FMIC & Radiator

GT2871R Turbo & Sheild

Turbo & H&S Downpipe

HKS Dump Valve

Downpipe and SS Decat

BlueFlame Catback

BlueFlame Back Box

One minor issue, I found that the SIP hoses are a bit loose (I ordered the 80mm hoses rathar than the 76mm ones for a 3" SIP). I tried to source them locally but couldn't. I will ask the workshope to fit them temporary and I'll buy new ones online to be fitted later on.

When I left the workshop, they were fitting the suspension parts (OEM shocks and Eibach springs, front and rear). OEM Brake discs and pads to follow.

The workshop people didn't know what to do with the hose coming from the crankcase ventilation system separator (as my SIP doesn't have any ho;e), so I bought this breather for them to fit.

After that, thay will fit the PIU front bumper and the LE side skirts and give the car a full paint in black

Getting closer and closer

Looking good as always

A few things i spotted, have you got the original heat shield
which you need to fit over the oil return from the turbo

and you need to run a turbo support bracket.

Ben

congratulations hani,,,its about to be true

dont worry about the wiring mod, we will do it anyway,,,it would be easy though..

@ Benny, Thank mate The oil return pipe heat sheild and the turbo support bracket are availble and will be fitted.

@ Omran, thanks for the usual support from you mate

I had a small problem with the routing of the ProAlloy FMIC piping and hoses. I ended up using one of the OEM hoses and it was connected to the plastic pipe (which connects to the throttle body). Omran came along and helped with the routing.. thanks Omran

The workshop has almost completed the mechanical works and moving to electrical works and connections.

Engine startup shall be very soon

Electrical works are done on today. Fianl works on AC, fans, hoses, wires,.... etc.

Engine Bay - 1

Engine Bay - 2

They fitted the quicktap on the turbo compressor outlet hose and connected it to the the wastegate actuator

QuickTap - 1

QuickTap - 2

For the brake system (front and rear), they have skimed the brake discs, fitted new pads and painted the calipers

Front Brake - 1

Front Brake - 2

Rear Brake

Mineral (non-synthetic) oil, gearbox oil, cooling water, brake fluid, power steering fluid are all filled in the car.

Finally, they are starting the car for the 1st time on tomorrow. I'll be there when they start it and can't wait for it

good luck hani, hope you all the best,,,, let me know the results mate...

hope its gone well Hani!

good luck!

Thanks Omran and Marco20valveT

It's been a nice day with a smile on my face

They started the engine.. here is a short video I took.

No stange sounds or strange lights on the dashboard. You can notice the Coupé paranoia; I went to the cabin to check the oil pressure and I found it on 3 bar

However, 4 of my injectors didn't work and they used the injectors of another Coupé which was in the workshop. Above start was with the other car injectors, this is why they are the holding the fuel rail during the start (they didn't fully fix it).

Anyway, my injectors are OEM ones but Barbz cleaned them before fitting them to the engine. I'm not sure how they failed to work. Fortunately, they have 4 new injectors in stock and they will manage to fit them. I'll use the OEM injectors, 3.8bar FPR and the Walbro 255lph fuel pump (with wiring mod) for fuelling during the break-in period. After that, I'll fit the big MAF, 440cc injectors and stage 5 chip from Flea.

On today, I've choosen the color of the paint for both body (Code 601 – Nero met - Black metallic which came on the 98-99 LE edition) and wheels (dark grey)

The worst thing on today was when they told me about the cost figures upto date , my wallet will suffer for the next couple of months

Anyway.. I'm happy on today. It's a matter of couple of weeks and the Coupé is on the roads again

Nice work!

As i said a few posts above, i've fitted this turbo (GT2871R) on my FIAT Marea 20VT.

I'm using 5 Siemens 55lb/h injectors to feed 432whp with ethanol. I think the 440cc/min (~42 lb/h) injectors you intend to use are perfect for the application running with gasoline.

About the FMIC i see on the pictures, i think it is a little big to this turbo, specially if you use low boost (less than 15psi). An oversized intercooler will increase the turbo lag, wich sucks on daily-driving conditions.

You should imagine how much air the turbo will produce to fill this IC. I think its a lot of air. This is how i guess you will need to run with higher boost 20-25psi or more!!!

To have an idea, my FMIC has 55x30x5cm and guys here in Brazil who runs with GT3076R uses 65x40x7cm for 600whp and up! My car has full boost on 4500rpm....

Off course, this is just my opinion!

Anyway, good luck!

Thanks for your comments and wishes Weiler

Regarding the fuelling, as you mentioned I think the 440cc injectors, walbro 255lph fuel pump and a 3.8bar FPR will be enough for my car, Flea confirmed the same as well.

As for the FMIC, I feel the same (big FMIC) everytime I look at this photo



Actually, this FMIC is the famous ProAlloy FMIC and I got it back in 2005 from the 1st group buy organized by Phil (Highwayman).

Believe me in this country, I need a proper cooling and I based my selection on the results on Phil's car and the interest generated by many Coupé users in here. After that, it has shown very good results and I recall there were 4 or 5 group buys after the first one.

I'm quoting the specs of this FMIC from an earlier post by Phil:



I know it is a little big + its routing is not the best and might cause some lag, but will see.

Boost wise, I hope I can see full boost by 3,800-4,200RPM and don't worry, it'll not be less than 25psi (1.7 bar)

Why do you use mineral (non-synthetic) oil?

Only during the break-in period Freddan.

AFAIK, for a re-built engine and during break-in period, it is preferred to use mineral oil for proper seating of piston rings. Mineral oil has low lubrication and hence high friction which helps the rings seating.

Quote from Wikipedia on one of the disadvantages of synthetic oils:



Anyway, after the break-in period (which will be around 1,500km), I'll use a fully synthetic oil, most probably Mobil 1 15W-50.

Hi,

You have the HKS dump valve, but you do not have MAP sensor like 16VT has. I had HKS (chinese copy) without recirculation. I recommed to modify it to bypass and route the measured air back just after Air Flow Meter.

Then you car won't turn to rich and hesitate so much after gear changes.
You can buy this small add in pipe to you HKS from ebay for example.
Do not worry, you still get the nice sound !
http://i723.photobucket.com/albums/ww234/ismo67/Directinductionpipe2.jpg

http://i723.photobucket.com/albums/ww234/ismo67/BlowofftoBypassSSQV2.jpg

Recirculation Fitting to SSQV:

http://www.frsport.com/HKS-71002-XA001-Recirculation-Fitting-for-SSQV-Blow-off-Valve_p_12931.html

Thanks Ismo,

Actually, the HKS DV has the bose for the recirculation (see red circle)



I think they have connected it by now. Need to update photos everyday now

How often do you need to change oil during break-in period?

Once, it's not a long period / distance.

some people do swap it twice during the break in period. I only did it once myself.

I did it twice: first at 500km, second at 2000km, both with mineral oil (Shell Helix 15w50).

Now I use Motul 6100 15w50.

And when did you change to the Motul 6100 15W50 Weiler?

After the second oil change.

In fact, i'm using this oil since 2006 and i'm very happy with its overall performance.

I know Motul is a good oil but the problem here is we don't have it at all.

Even Mobil 1, we have the synthetic 0W40 oil which is too thin for our cars so I have to source the 15W50 from outside when the oil change times comes.

No major updates

Their bodyshop is very busy, my wheels are in the queue waitnig for refurbishment and paint.

Initial connection for the gauges (boost, fuel pressure, EGT & wideband AFR) are done:









I told them to prepare a route fort he gauges wiring and they are working on it, I'll take the gauges to them on Saturday for a test.

Air filter is properly located and fitted on today, they used one of the old elbows as a neck for the air filter and they fabricated the silver support bracket:





I had to buy 4 new tyres as my old ones are square in shape now (they've been stting for 4.5 years collecting heat and dust). So, Falken FK452 tyres (size: 225/45ZR16) were my choice:



Practically speaking, nothing major is pending. Its all minor issues and the delay for painting the wheels and the body is really headache as they are very busy. Anyway, I have to wait a little more

Hi,

It is not that vacuum pipe, look on the other side of the reed circle.. now the blow off valve releases already measured air (by air flow meter)to atmosphare.
That air should be captured and routed back to indcution pipe just after AFM
(not before, check my earlier post and check the direct induction pipe picture)in cars which has Air Flow Meter in the induction pipe.


1. So, first you measure how much the engine will have air by AFM - right?
2. Then ECU measures how much gasoline will be released to the engine by injectors - right?

If you blow off part of the already measured air by air leak or by blow off valve, engine will run very rich for a while - right?

So, that was why I recommened to modify HKS to bypass mode (very fast and easy job to add that bypass pipe to you HKS.

So, without bypass mod you car will run, but for my experience it is annoying hesitation without bypass modification.

I am of course wrong if you are not using anymore AFM and you are running aftermarket ECU with MAP sensor.

Hi Ismo,

Are above points considering that my SIP (induction pipe) has an opening for the DV bypass (recirculation) like yours? my SIP doesn't have any opening.

And yes, I'll be running the OEM ECU and AFM.

Anyway, when mapping time comes, I need to consider this point with Flea since I'll be using the big MAF conversion.

Hi,

I can see there is two about 19mm hose places on your Induction pipe (Earlier picture what you send to this tread)

I have 29mm openning(home made pipe, only one on that type existing :)), but maybe 19mm is big enough also?

One for bypass valve operation?
One for for crank fumes?

Ismo

Ok..

The tapered SIP in the begining of this thread is my initial plan when I was going to use the GT28R turbo. It is this one:



When I changed to the GT2871R, I prefered to have the 3" induction pipe and what Barbz supplied was with no holes. Here is a photo of my new (and already installed SIP):



As for the crank fumes, I used a breather:



Sorry for the confusion and thanks for the help

hani, there are 4 pipes that go into the SIP...
are you using breathers for them also?

if not what are you doing with them?

i was thinking of making my own sip also but didnt know if i could use a straight pipe with no holes or get one with holes!!

I really forgot the standard setup of these hoses Marco

I can recall 3 out of 4 hoses connecting to the induction pipe as follows:

- from EBV (this will be unplugged to run actuator pressure temporary until I fit the APEXi AVC-R)
- from DV (I've fited the atmospheric HKS SSQV DV)
- from oil vapour recirculation (I've fitted a breather)

hmm i may need to play around with this and see whats what!!

thanks any way hani!

glad its coming alone well!

There's only one thing left to say - is that BOV blow the air off ONLY WHEN YOU FULLY CLOSE THE THROTTLE. In this moment, ECU cuts fueling or enters idle map, so no MAF signal is needed for any fueling.

We use different types of BOV (Greddy RS, HKS, no-brand mods) - no problems at all...

I went to the workshop on today. The wheels are having the final primer coat and will be sprayed tomorrow.

I've spotted something strange today, they replaced the DV 1" hose with a longer one like this:



They said that previously (with the short 1" hose), the DV was touching the battery.

My question, is it ok to have the DV installed with such long hose? does it affect the dumping of the valve?

I don't think so, but wanted to make sure.

is that fixed down because that look awfully close to the fan and with a hose that long it will move about quite a bit.

not sure if the hose will have any affect on the car though.

Nick

Yeah Nick, it's facing downside. When I looked at it in the workshop, it didn't seem to be close to the fans.

Anyway, when they fit the battery, we'll have better look on the space there and fit it propoerly.

Thats fine, it won't affect the DV operation.

Ben

Thanks Banny

i dont think it will touch the battery, but no issues. it will be tight but it could fit.
anyway, this is very simple and you can change it later yourself once you get the car. just take the hose from them.

Omran

Yeah Omran, it's an easy job. I'll play with the hoses later on.

Now, I only hope to get the car as soon as possible

Finally, the wheels are sprayed, tyres fitted and installed on the car

Wheels before spray:



During refurbishment:



After spray:



On the car:



Also, I felt that the car is low (suspension setup: new OEM shocks + Eibach new lowering springs, front and rear). It seems I'll face hard times with our bad roads over here



Next week, the car is moving to the body workshop (at Fiat delaer as well) to fit the PIU front bumper and LE side skirts, then full spray time.

The rims look very nice. I had my Plus rims overhauled 2007. The color is called "Black Chrome"

Thanks Freddan, Yeah, they look nice and I rally liked them. I forgot what was the color but it wasn't a Fiat color.

I hope they match the body color (Code 601 – Nero met - Black metallic) nicely.

About your rims, they really look nice in that coloe especially they are the Plus model rims

the color is dark grey..i have the some color rims

Yeah dragos, it's dark grey but I meant the color code / name in the colors catalogue

Fiat agent over here has a nice colors catalogue for all OEM cars colors

hi, can i ask, how much you pay ProAlloy Radiator?

thanks

Hi,

it's for £375 (almost € 440).

I got it from here: ProAlloy

It's been a while since the last update

The body workshop was fully occupied during the last weeks and finally, they started with my car yesterday.

The PIU bumper is fitted on the car to check how it fits and if some trimming is required, here it is:



LE side skirts to follow tomorrow and hopefully body preperation for paint will start next week.

I have a couple of questions:

1- my old oil cooler duct is broken and I don't feel I'm going to fit it again. Does it affect (raise) oil temperatures when not installed? Ok, did a little search and seems to be ok but Highwayman noticed increased oil temperature when he removed the duct. I might put it back then, will see

2- oil pressure gauge takes a while to rise when I start the car, here is a video to get an idea. I know the gauge shouldn't rise when the ignition on and engine is off but I'm talking about when I turn on the engine. Is that normal? (I forgot how it was acting in the past)

Can anyone confirm if above oil pressure gauge behaviour in the video is fine?

perfectly normal.

Cheers Dave

fine fine hani

Thanks Omran

LE side skirts were fitted for test only:



Front bumper and side skirts are removed again for spray, full spray of the car to follow.

Time for some update

Visited the workshop today and finally they started with my car again.

The front bumper got the mesh now and ready for paint



The car is going through body treatment process and expecting the spray soon, will be ready within a week or 10 days time, I guess



The fuel cap looks really bad. I'm thinking to spray it, same color as the wheels



As for the interior, the following are now fitted:

Sparco pedals



Sparco handbrake handle



Sparco gear knob, it looks odd but the gaiter needs some adjustment. About 2 inches were removed from the gear lever. My transmission now have short shifter and short lever

I removed the duct for the IC for a while this summer and the cooling got a lot worse, with higher fuel consumption.

Thanks for the feedback Per

hey hani u ve got a nice ride over there i am from oman i ve got an 20v tubro LE from oman same colour and i would like us to get to be in touch so we can know how to manage tuning the cars and make a group

Thanks mate

I have relatives in Oman so might be able meet you when I'm over there.

As for the tuning, we have Barbz (the Coupé tuning expert) here in the region in UAE and he can assist a lot.

Regards

Lovely project indeed.

Thanks pjd30

Not much of update. Body work is almost over and the primer coat is almost complete. Spray shall take place this week if their air compressor works, it's out of service now . Quality of work done till now is excellent.

Here is the Coupé as of yesterday:







Rear bumper is still untouched though

I hope to get car on streets by November

very good i love your project....very nice any news today??

Thanks leugim_21

No new news yet. I go to Fiat workshop every Saturday & Tuesday so might have an update by tomorrow.

hum ok..your car inside need a good clean

Don't worry leugim_21, it'll get a good clean from inside

Finally, the car is sprayed, here are some pictures as of yesterday:



Spray quality seems excellent. Work is still in progress as you can see. I'm going again tomorrow and hope to see the car uncovered and with the bonnet fixed

nice project

please change racing grids behind the piu front in some in plastic black..like http://cgi.ebay.de/KUNSTSTOFF-WABENGITTE...=item4ceac81a5c

but thats my taste

Thanks mate.

I'm sure I'll need to replace the mesh in the PIU bumper in future as it'll be deteriorated, I might consider the mesh type you posted in future, it looks nice

coooool,,,, about to be real
keep up hani,,

Thanks Omran, yea it's coming real

Here is the Coupé as of today:



The LE side skirts are ready and will be fitted tomorrow. The fuel cap is sparayed with the same colour of the wheels and I think it looks nice.

The car wouldn't start on today I think the fuel pump (new Walbro 255) has gone!!! the car had very low fuel level for the last 4 months (while being in the workshop) and has been started few times. Once it was filled with fuel yeaterday, it wouldn't start They will check it after finishing the body polish.

Lovely and i can't wait for the car to be ready it's already HOT soo far

Maybe there is just some air in the lines.

Regarding front bumper, I would definitely add some black mesh to the it. It will look great. You can call it "the black stallion"

Possible Freddan. I also think the new fuel got mixed up with the old fuel in the car and maybe blocked something or seized the pump. I don't recall that I heared the pump priming / whining thought. They will check today and I hope it's a minor issue. I wish I had the time to stay in the workshop everyday to stay on the top of them!!!

The good thing is that Omran has a spare pump so I'll not have to wait to order a new one in case it turns up to be a pump problem

As for the bumper, it has a black mesh but seems to be a light mesh type. I shall consider other mesh options.

And yeah, once the Coupé is finished, I'll be having two black stallions

It could also be a clogged fuel filter.

cool hani,,, i dont know, but i dont feel like the pump has any problem,,, it could be the clogged fuel filter as freddan said..check the voltage in and out hani..

anyhow, the pump is sitting next to me waiting for you

Hani,
it looks brilliant!!

good work!

It turned to be a problem with old fuel in the car so fuel filter was replaced, the injectors and the spark plugs were cleaned.

So the car is started again with better idle than before. It was tested inside the workshop yard and acheived runing oil & water temperature with solid 2.6 bar oil pressure.

@ Omran, keep the fuel pump, you know I'll need it one day

@ Freddan & Marco, thanks for the heads up

On the progress side, the LE side skirts & lights are fitted. I received the clear side lights by the time I was going to the workshop, still not fitted though



I've fitted the front and rear Fiat badges, the front one is new original badge but sprayed in black and the rear is a commercial one (from ebay) coming in black



More updates next week.

hum very nice...:) amazing project keep the good work and a good clean

finally :)))))

"Marbrouk"

Very nice, congratulations..

Cheers Omran & cario

The car is almost ready. The car will get a nice clean and polish from outside and inside in the next few days and I'll take it to the technical inspection (MOT) next week. If evrything is fine I shall drive it home... finally

Here are some pics:



The gauges in action:

AEM Wideband AFR on Startup

AEM Wideband AFR - Car is Working (Fluctuating a lot, is that normal? )

Defi Gauges on Startup

I think the lambda value was the same on the Widget. Up and down and up and so on......

congratulations Hani,,,,

i like the gauges soo much & i would really like to sit in it

nice progress continue the good job Hani

@ Freddan72, I know it should fluctuate but I thought it was fluctuating a lot . It seems normal to me now

@ Omran, soon mate

@ leugim_21, thanks mate

Nice gauges Hani, looks like you have been copying me, as i have the exactly same gauges (oil pressure, boost and exhaust temp)

EDIT : noticed you have fuel pressure, not oil pressure

Thanks Alexis

and we both have very long Coupé projects

Congratulations Hani

I'm sure you'll be on the road very soon

Let us know mate!

nice!!!

Took the car to the tehnical inspection (MOT) yesterday and it wasn't a good day

I had tow issues:

1- Brakes completely failed during the test (on the test rollers) and I heared an air venting sound from the brakes. Also, the brake pedal got too hard. I got the car towed back to Fiat workshop. I think the brake master cylinder failed but I'm waiting a confirmation from the workshop.

2- The car passed the emissions test at idle. However, when pressing the gas pedal, there is a small amount of black smoke coming from the exhaust. I think the car is running rich and it has a rough idle. I'm using a 3.8 bar FPR on standard injectors and stock ECU/chip, can this cause overfuelling or the ECU can adapt the bigger FPR?

Also, the workshop is suspecting than one of the ignintion coils is not working well and causing the rough idle.

Any thoughts on fuelling issue?

Note: The nice thing yesterday was that I drove the car for the 1st time since 07-Dec-2004 and the paddle clutch was fun to drive for the 1st time

The ECU doesn't work well with bigger injectors. I recommend you to install OE injectors and FPR if you are planning to drive the car for a while before you install the Flea map.
I tried bigger injectors with Gtec2. The boost pressure was much better when I reinstalled the OE injectors. I was really surprised to see that the boost pressure went up without doing any changes to the EBC.

But now I understand that I got a better burn and more exhausts so the turbo spooled up better.

Thanks Freddan.

Maybe I wasn't clear, I have standard injectors, 3.8 FPR and stock ECU/chip

I thought it said bigger injectors yesterday. I was too tired, my mistake

Of course if you hold more fuel then it will overfuel. It's simple as that. But the system adapt so in the long run you will run lean.

he he finaly its works nice job Hani

No worries Freddan

Thanks leugim

Barbz will send me a brake master cylinder and a brake servo so I can fit them and go for the MOT again next week. He will also send me some good coils as it might help the idle and the black smoke issue and as suspected by the workshop people.

Here is the car on the sad MOT day

Mission Accomplished...

Bad luck is chasing me, I drove the car for 1 day only

While driving the car, it stalled and wouldn't start again. I suspected the battery as it was rated @ 66Amp one which was 4 months old and not used a lot so I thought it was dead.

I replaced the battery with Bosch one rated @ 74Amp and drove the car back to the Bosch service centre and while driving the airbag warning light came out followed by the ABS warning light. The other gauges started to flash and the car wanted to stall and it actually stalled 5mtrs from Bosch service centre and wouldn't start again

Anyway, I asked them to check the electrical system on the car. Car is started via jump leads and checked by a meter which says "9.6 volt, too low". It should be around 14volt, it's an alternator problem

I'm not sure if this problem is due to the grounding kit that I installed recently. I need to check all the connections again

Another problem, I found my fuel tank leaking!!! I recall that the workshop had it removed during the car restoration for cleaning so I hope the leak is due to fixing problem and not due crack in the tank (there were no physical cracks observed by me).

The car is towed back to Fiat workshop but I hope to get it back on road by next week.

just minor problems mate, compared to the task's you have done your lucky its just minor things!

fingers crossed your back on the road again soon!

I hate alternator problems, common Coupe-fault, hence why they put a volt-meter in on the last years cars. Had exactly the same symtpoms when mine gave up. Maybe it's too hot there?

@ Marco, thanks mte I know that minor things will rise up from time to time especially that the car has been standing for long time before the restoration.

@ Per, I hate alternator problems as well . It's not that hot here now, actually the weather is getting colder.

I had to call the workshop by noon time and they told me no need to remove the alternator as there was a electrical short outside the alternator. I hope the fuel leak issue is minor and I can take the car back tomorrow

Your Car looks awsome specially a huge difference with PIU bumper that just fantastic....I hope you will come up with the above problem. Lemme know if you need anything from here....
Best!

Thanks mate

Yeah, the PIU bumper made a huge difference to the car's front and look.

I took the car from the workshop but I still have a problem with the alternator and the car is stalling . I'm starting another thread in the Technical Issues/General Maintenance sections on this problem.

Time for an update

I've finished the break-in period. Ordered the 440cc injectors and received them. Ordered the chip (stage 5) and spark plugs from Flea and should receive it soon.

I drove the car mainly around the city during calm nights and avoided traffic, topped at 3-4k RPM, saw 0.5-0.6 bar of boost.

I hope the chip will solve the issues I had during the break-in period like: engine stalling when coming suddenly to idle, idle problems (sometimes), tending to misfire at certain RPMs.

The car will go to the workshop soon to carryout the following:

- Oil change (I'll go with Castrol 10w60 fully synthetic)
- Coolant drain and refill with green fluid
- Install the new spark plugs
- Fit the big MAF housing
- Fit stage 5 chip
- Install the APEXi AVC-R boost controller
- Check the car generally again

Then take it the RR for a dyno run to see how it runs and fuels, fingers crossed

All I think about now is: I want to push the car and see how it runs on streets

I don't think you will be disappointed after flooring it

What do you think, is 400 crank hp achievable?

I hope the same Fredrick

As for the horsepower, I really want to go beyond this figure

I think the car has the right specs to achieve 400hp but as we all know, many factors affects this. My aim is to get sort of nice and smooth power safely, will see how it goes.

Few updates:

- Fitted the FC stage 5 chip from flea
- Fitted the big MAF housing
- Fitted the 440cc injectors and colder spark plugs
- Fitted the APEXi AVC-R boost controller
- Fitted the new silicon coolant hoses (from DavidL group buy) and coolant fluid
- Replaced the oil (used synthetic Castrol 10W/60) and oil filter. Noticed real improvement in oil pressure (2.5-2.7 bar when on hot idle)

After driving the car for few days, I noted better throttle response, smooth RPM buildup. It seems to have potential for power once the foot on the throttle , I still didn't push it hard though . Previous misfire problems disappeared now as well

However, the SIP causes a rough idle sometimes and car tends to stall if RPMs go down quickly.

I'm now taking different readings and coordinating with Flea. I still need to do the wiring mod for the fuel pump before taking the car to the dyno next Saturday hopefully.

More updates soon

This is a truly epic build Hani, congratulations it sounds like it's going to be a monster when it's fully mapped

Nice Hani

Can't wait to know your dyno results

Finally, I took the car to the dyno yesterday and made few runs . The weather was hot, the ambient temperature was 30 deg.C

Also, it seems that I have a problem with the APEXi boost controller and setting it or a boost leak somewhere. Thus, I'm not able to go beyond 1.4-1.5 bar of boost.

Anyway, the car has made 346.5hp at just below 1.4 bar. Here is the graphs:

Engine HP Vs. AFR:



Wheel HP Vs. Boost:



Torque Vs. AFR showing wheel HP figure on graph:



To be honest, I was expecting something around 350hp @ 1.4 bar of boost so I was close

I've sent all the information to Flea so he review and see what changes are required on the map/chip. It's worth saying that the car has also made 277.8hp @ only 0.65 bar of boost.

Also, there is something wrong with the scale calibration of the dyno. The graph cuts on around 6,900RPM which is below my 7,200RPM redline

In summary, I'm quite satisfied with the results and more satisfied with the performance of the car on street.

It's also worh mentioning that the AFR in the road is more close to the 11.5-11.7 rather than what's shown on the graph 11.8-12. I think this is quite normal variation.

I had a tussle with my friend's 2005 E55 AMG the other day and it was nice keeping side by side with him. Video will be soon on the YouTube if someone is interested

Nice!

At what rpm do you have max wheel hp and torque?

It's difficult to see on the graph

Cheers Fredrik

Actually, the RPM on the graph isn't correct due to the dyno calibration I guess. If my assumtion is coorect to shift the power curve to the right by 500RPM, this means that the power is @ 6,300 approximately.

I'm sure Flea will be here soon to comment on the results.