first road bike

I have decided to get a road bike, primarily for commuting to work (4 miles a day) and also fitness.

Don't want to spend much so will be looking to get a second hand bike for £200.

I have found two - a claud butler san remo 2012 road bike and a carrera tdf 2009 model, i think.

The claud butler is pretty much standard and the tdf has got double sided pedals (clip one side, normal the other) wheels are upgraded to shimano with amerityre airless puncture proof tires and the gear system inc rear cassette recently replaced. Don't know how much better these things are but maybe worth mentioning.

Out of the two, what would you suggest I go for?

Thanks,
Rod

Neither

Have a read of This thread and get a triban 3 from Decathlon

JV

If the commute is 2 miles each way, you're probably not too concerned about keeping your feet securely on the pedals, but if you want clip pedals you can easily add them to the Claud Butler. The recently replaced rear cassette on the TDF is good, but maybe it was the chain that had worn, has that been replaced? It's only 3 years, i wnder how else it has been (ab)used?

What intrigues me is the Amerityre airless tyres, I've never even heard of them, I wonder how much they weigh compared to normal thin wall tyres and an inner tube full of air. The heavier the wheel/tyre, the harder it will be to cycle along, but I can't find much info about them, other than they have 700x25 "street tread" and 700x35 "all terrain tread" sizes.

Is the commute route flat or does it have hills? Big ones or small ones? It might determine what gearing you need, what's the spec for each bike in terms of gears? Also how about the brakes. Are you happy with drop handlebars? Do you know what type of gear shifters you like?

I have a couple of friends with Carrera TDFs.
The chainset on the front of the TDF was a problem for one, so he improved it with a compact one (34 tooth smaller cog) improving its ability to climb hills.
Considering the racing configuration I don't really understand its lack of speed. Maybe poor tyres?

Claude Butler looks interesting.

My £200 bike became a £330 bike by the time I'd bought new bearings all round BB bearings, brake pads, and some proper tyres.

The Triban is a higher spec than both with its carbon forks but the gears etc. look to be on a par.

If you're commuting you should consider things like mudguards (i.e. the frame needs to offer enough clearance), and also whether it will stop in the wet. I'm finding disc brakes save me regularly from running into the back of things.

Is there something wrong with the 2 bikes I've mentioned? Only they are available for me to view in the next couple days ( need a bike ASAP really) and will buy on the spot if it's as advertised. It may take a while to hold out for a triban 3.. There's only one on eBay as an auction.

Dave, the commute is 4 miles each way. I will ask him about the chain now.

I am new to this, so literally have no experience with drop handlebars and gear shifters. I've only just googled how to change gear on the tdf and still don't get it! Closest I have got to riding a road bike are the bikes in the gym!

As for the journey. It is mostly flat and on the road. The final mile has a few hills, not lasting long but some are fairly steep. The final hundred meters are on a cycle bath which is more off road and a bit rough so may walk the bike for that section to avoid any problems.

Rod

I use a "cyclocross" bike for my commute since several miles are off road through forest tracks (a mix of mud, sand, stones and grass, oh, and large pothles and huge puddles) and unmade roads. These bikes are like road bikes with drop handlebars but have more clearance for wider tyres and (usually) clearance for mudguards and mounting eyes. The often have secondary "interrupter" brake levers on the top of the handlebars. But they seem more pricey than the equivalent "hybrid" flat handlebar version. I found my old hybrid OK up hills but too slow on road, some 'cross bikes have a narrow range of gears but my two favourites have a wide ratio of 50/11 (largest ring on front / smallest ring on rear) = 4.55 for going fast on road/downhill, and a very low 34/32 = 1.06 (2 front rings) or 30/28 = 1.07 (3 front rings) (smallest front / largest rear) for going up steep hills or for where traction is poor and you need to go slow in case you need to stop or get off suddenly.

Triban 3 is £299 new BTW

The TDF is only £299 new so are those upgrades worth it?
Have they upgraded beyond the 2300 8 speed setup?

The Claude Butler is £359 new, but if it has hardly any miles it might be the better option.

Buying a worn / tired bike can be expensive.

Good point. I am a bit worried about buying a 3 yr old bike when I could get brand new for an extra 100. Here is the link for the carrera tdf:

http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/carrera-tdf-road-bike/1004023282#gallery-item-full-1

Can't really make out the letters on the bike but it doesnt look like its reads tdf!?

So far the Claude butler is winning, but I'm still in two minds about them

The wheels look like the Shimanos on my Focus.
They give a good turn of speed but need a bit of care over the potholes, so you would need to check them for buckling etc.

Presumably the seller has sunk a bit of money into it and wants it back hence the high price.

I'd rather have clips both sides of the pedals. If you stop at a traffic light you have to put your foot down. Now try to spin the pedal round onto the right side so you can clip in while all the cars around you take off.

Proper Shimano M520 pedals with clips both sides are only about £17 and mine came with some plastic inserts for times when other people want to use it.

Carrera =Halfrauds own brand

I think I've found the wheels.
Shimano RS20 click

Thanks for that mate.well i tried pushing my luck and offering a bit less but hes not budging. Off to view the claude butler in 20 mins so will see how i feel about it and let you know. Really should have done more research before a viewing.

That seems to be a good decision.
Maybe you'll get a phone call soon.

You can't go too far wrong really.
That £200 will be back in your pocket in saved travel costs before you know it and you'll be trying to figure out how to raise the next £500.

Just to hijack this thread slightly, Dolan are selling off carbon- framed Campag equipped road bikes for £750-ish which is a total steal. Very limited numbers though (and don't be put off by their weird sizing)

Back OT and the Claude Butler sounds better. Don't like the sound of those airless tyres - you'll be £30-40 out of pocket putting some proper tyres on it. And +1 for proper double-sided pedals - you can guarantee that the asymmetric ones will always be the wrong way up.

Thanks. Well I've decided to go for the Claude butler. Managed to get him down to £170 which I think is a steal for this years model. Read way too many things about the carrera being typical halfrauds quality. The Claude butler might not be top quality but reviews look better plus it's been seviced twice.. Hopefully good enough as a first bike.

Just got to man up and get some cycling shorts now. Pretty sure jeans/tracksuits are a no go. Oh and get some shoes.

Thanks for everyone's advice, really appreciate it.

I own two of them.

If its any consolation i was only referring to the tdf...

dhb stuff from Wiggle is good value cycling gear

One of mine is the tdf, the other's the Virtuoso, i've found both to be okay apart from the original pedals. Good luck with the Claude Butler, sounds like a good buy.

I've had a few Carrera bikes (all MTB) and found them to be excellent quality. The same cannot be said of the after service or the staff they employ. They don't know a derailleur from their own d*ck!

That's a good result! Back in the '80s owning a Claude Butler was like owning a Rolls Royce. What's the condition like? Has it done many miles?
If you're on a shoestring these shorts are only a tenner and these shoes are less than any I've seen too. Pedals seem to be an eBay thing.
This time of year you also need ski gloves, 3 pairs of socks (so go big on the shoes), overshoes, and mudguards, so just as well you saved a few pennies.

I wouldn't listen to me... I'm a complete newbie who only just found out how to change gears this morning! I spoke to two shops In Cardiff and one online and they will obviously be biased as they don't sell them.

Pick up the bike tomorrow. Can't Wait to wear something silly and hit the road this weekend!

That would explain why my chain keeps coming off...

Great condition. Has been used once for the carten 100 mile bike race and a few 5-10 mile commutes. Had a quick go and it felt great. Gears were very smooth and it picked up speed very quickly

thanks for the links... will take a look now. in the middle of moving house so I'm always looking for a bargain

Can I suggest you tread very carefully with cheap cycling gear. Some of it is good and some awful. If I've learned anything it's to buy the best I can afford at the time. Careful too with gloves - you'll struggle to operate the gears with heavy gloves on, especially if you aren't familiar with the levers. I'm not using gloves even close to that heavy until the temperature is well below freezing at which point you won't want to be riding a road bike on ice.

Do keep an eye out for Aldi and Lidl cycle gear that is sold in campaigns - it's apparently great value but sells very very quickly. dhb is excellent though - buy that if you can afford it.

Finally, if you aren't used to road bikes, be aware that the tyres need to be pumped up to around 100psi or more else you will get "pinch flat" punctures. You need either a very good hand pump or a track pump (I think Tesco sell a useable one) to get to 100psi - you need something with a pressure gauge.

Just to echo what MRS said, don't buy cheap ebay gear, the majority of it is from sweat shops in China and is shite. However the Aldi stuff is very good, I have shorts, socks and a gilet from there.

Check out Wiggle for shorts, tops etc. quite often the have end of line sales.

Good advice above. I've possibly sampled more than my fair share of cheap eBay rubbish, and impulse bought a fair bit of the cycling crap peddled by LIDL and Sainsbury's.

A LIDL speedo that wouldn't register >25mph and snapping Sainsbury's tyre levers come to mind as good examples.

The MuddyFox / Sports Direct products are inexplicably cheap given the quality. The £8 shorts have done me 3500 miles already without a sore arse.

Fair point about the ski gloves MRS, but even with them and a pair of running gloves underneath my hands were still cold this morning and changing gear was not a problem. Also ski gloves resist water where a lot of them aren't ideal in the rain.

thanks, I was temped to get the shoes, shorts and top from amazon as I have a voucher but I will head to aldi first.

As for shoes, I will try them on when possible with extra socks on but from what people are saying should I go a size larger?

Oh and with regards to mudflaps - will they be specific to my bike or do universal ones generally fit? I found these cheap ones on ebay but the seller doesn't know if they will fit my bike:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=221157555377&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123

Lots to learn and a stupid time of the year to start!

PS 100psi for tires? is that standard for most bikes or will it change depending on what tires my bike has?

I have a set of long mudguards like these.
SKS
The shorter ones are good for keeping the mud off your back, but longer ones keep more of the road grit etc. out of the chain and gears. You also get a lot less water onto your feet.

100psi is a minimum.
Many of them won't even ride up properly onto the rim until you're past that point.
Most road tyres specify between 105 and 125 psi.

There's a thread here where I tested lots of different pumps and suffered the kind of problems you get when you've bought a pump made for a mountain bike.

Get a track pump and as skinflint says 100psi is the minimum. My road bike runs at 120psi and my tourer at 100 unladen and 125 with the racks on.

Aldi don't sell the cycling gear all the time. They have 3 or 4 promotions a year but you have to be VERY quick as it goes in no time.

I think we need a 'Show us your bike(s) thread'

great, will get a set of the long ones this weekend. will also try and hunt down a good pump. ah, and a helmet, i totally forgot about that!

Don't forget lights too, you can never have too many, although some are really poor value for the inflated prices charged. skinflint's tyre thread also covered lights and overshoes. And think about hi-viz/reflective gear, either a vest, a sash, or a hi-viz jacket with reflective bits, I have a hi-viz waterproof rucksack, but you can get hi-viz/reflective covers for ruck sacks too. Your pedals are supposed to have reflectors too, I have some clip on crappy use-once-and-throw-away things for the SPD M540's pedals on one of my bikes. I also have some relfective strips that wrap around your legs/arms.

Be visible - stay alive!

Good advice, DaveG! Also, I saw the police in Cambridge stopping cyclists that had no lights last night, which I believe is a £30 on-the-spot fine. So it can be a costly business in many ways!

There's a chap I overtake regularly on the Wimpole road who has an amazing headlight but who has not taken the same care with his rear lights...

Yup - Check Aldi on-line but I've not heard of one coming yet. TBH you'd be better making do with some bits of kit that you already have that buying stuff that you'll only replace later.

I commute a 30-mile round trip in the Highlands all year round so I've learned quite a bit since I started (this particular commute) 3 years or so ago.

With cycling gear, focus on staying warm rather than dry. That said, your commute itself is relatively short so "waterproof" gear might just keep you dry that long. It doesn't actually rain that often though.

That's a really good point.
It is nicer to be a little bit wet from rain that boiling in a bag of your own sweat.
The Nike Dri-Fit fabrics (and presumably other equivalents from other companies) are pretty close to perfect for keeping you warm, dry and ventilated.

I stick with woolen undergarmets, merino if possible. These retain their warms even when damp. Never use cotton next to teh skin as once wet it will draw heat from your body at an alarming rate.

^ yep, i've been a skier for over 30 years and have tried EVERY type of thermal going, there are lots of 'technical' fibres around claiming this and that but the best by far is merino wool,
Icebreaker is superb, a bit pricey but well worth it.

thanks for all the info guys.
just been out on it quickly. Very nice to ride. only glitches so far are that the front brakes feel a little 'scrapier' than the rears and don't feel as sharp.
Going to take me a while to get used to these handlebars. find it strange using the brakes when your hands are on the top.
Need to look at maintenance too. Looking after the gears, chains and cleaning it.

How far should a Merino Wool fetish go? Are we talking socks or are there other garments?

Re: brakes, you just need to take a really good look at them and the cause should reveal itself. True wheels help a lot.

Chain: Separate thread needed, but I blast off the crud with Morrisons Maintenance Spray (a cheap WD40 replica) and then apply Finish Line Wet (which is a really thick green oil).

Merino base layers are very good but I find them too warm for much of the winter under my windproof jacket (my all-time favourite bit of kit). I use a very very thin Nike Pro base layer

I have merino socks, vest and cap. Stop short of getting the grundies in wool too

Nice and warm today. Single L/S top and bibshorts.
Sweated like a pig at FTP with cadence runaway for the last 3 minutes. Good power (293W). Pleased to report no accidents or ice on the turbo in the garage ...

Apparently Aldi ski kit goes on sale tomorrow wih merino tops and maybe one or two other bits that would work for cycling

You could always trawl Ebay for Assos, TAL Endura and ProVision stuff ...

Do you mind me asking what jacket that is?

I had a bit of an off at the weekend and managed to rip mine. I'm looking for something wind-proof, breathable and ideally water-resistant. It does need to be tough and sensibly priced as it'll more than likely be ready for the bin in a years time.

Any ideas?

Hmmm - I was all ready to tell you until this bit My jacket is the utterly superb Assos Airjack 851. Despite the price tag (Ive never paid more than 60% RRP BTW), mine (I have 2) take an absolute beating from October to April on my 30-mile RT commute. They get washed every day they are used and, apart from a bit of fading, they are as new. On the plus side, if you do rip them, Assos will repair it for free.

TBH, other jackets haven't quite matched these. I have a Gore Phantom 2 but it's just not as good.

They can be found cheaply or scour eBay

Thanks for the recommendation, to be honest if it was just for commuting or sensible xc I'd happily spend the money.

Unfortunately I do tend to get through kit as I'll use it for xc and downhill so it'll inevitably end up tagging a tree or arguing with the handlebars at some point!

Maybe £100+ on a jacket isn't sensible.

Nope

Stock up in Aldi

off to aldi after work. next question is pedals - i have clipless pedals but don't know which ones. Been told they are 3 hole compatible so was going to buy some 'look' cleats from ebay. Is there a way to determine what clips I have, and if so, can I only use certain types/makes?

What make are the pedals? There are loads of three hole cleats.

Of the top of my head:-
Time
Look Keo
Look Delta
Shimano SPD SL
Campagnolo Profit

None of the above are intercompatible either

A pic of the pedal posted here would solve this too.

OK, don't have a clue so will get a picture up on here a bit later and also ask the seller. Thanks

I found that buying a cheap pair of clipless pedals was better value (using man maths) than buying cleats.

Cleats alone £15
http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/road-tr...als/shimpeda800

Pedals and cleats £23.44
http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/road-tr...-sl/shimpedz200

While we're on the subject, I was quite amazed by how light the road shoes are in the shop the other day.

Apart from the "you can't walk far in road shoes" argument, is there any other reason to favour the MTB shoes?

Can you get your feet free easily if you want?

Sort of. It's not as easy as MTB SPD's, but then you have a lot more time to plan for things on road bikes.

You can soften the tension on road pedals (as you can do on the MTB ones).

To counter that I find releasing from my look pedals very easy as is engagement. I found SPDs no better, but then I hardly use them.

Heard back from the seller and he said shimano spd with 3 holes on the bottom. Here's a pic: (excuse the dirt)



and





That mean the look cleats I almost bought won't fit and it has to be shimano cleats?

Yep those are Shimano SPD SL Pedals IIRC

Clicky

You want the yellow cleats with float in them
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=28895

Luckily they're SPD-SL because Look cleats are made of cheese. You'll need a Road shoe (3-hole) - MTB shoes only have 2 holes. Or buy SPD M520 pedals with cleats from eBay. SPD cleats last forever and MTB shoes are easier to walk in (if you need to walk).

you can also get spd sl to spdr shoe adaptors (2 hole), so don't limit your shoe search to 3 hole. These adapters will also allow standard spd (2 hole).

How do they work with "studded" MTB shoes? I've seen adaptors that convert flat-soled 3-hole to 2-hole and I've seen flat-soled shoes with 2 and 3-hole patterns. Just never seen 2-hole to 3-hole adaptors and can't see how they'd work on my Sidi Dragon 2s for instance.

I've got the 3-hole to 2-hole (spd sl to spdr) adapters on my Shimano SH-R215E carbon road shoes. You are correct in that the adapter plate extends slightly beyond the footprint.

Are the 2 stud lozenges either side of the cleat position removal? if so the adapters will fit.

Ah yes - 3 hole to 2 hole I have (don't use them) - I thought you were suggesting the other direction