F1 championship finale

Well it would have been hard to written have the plot for this years racing and the ups and downs have been dramatic to say the least. Having enjoyed the racing particularly from Silverstone in the summer we have seen quite a number of debatable moves and decisions.
The one thing I saw yesterday that I found strange was race director Michael Massi holding negotiations as to which way a team wished to follow either lose a place or face the stewards decision. Surely the Stewards should be the ones to decide, or what’s the point in having them?
Whoever you support it’s set up for a season finale like we haven’t had in years.

Yes total confusion with the stewards options of change or be judged, but it added much drama along with two restarts, contact and Max's slowing to let LH pass etc etc, brilliant racing which really sets it up for next weekend, best season ever I feel, down to the wire, love it

By lap 43 I was starting to become a nervous wreck when watching the race, but the 10 second penalty for brake testing Hamilton sets a precedent to Max that he can pull that stunt again if he wants. I really really don't want the final race to be Max punting Hamilton off and winning by default because he has had more wins over the year

Last year was a kind of prelude to this season, with different venues, triple headers, substitute drivers and the strong feeling that Red Bull had finally cracked it.
This season has just been beyond words. Even without the once-in-a-generation clash of two unbelievably talented and polar opposite drivers, there's been so much other drama in the supporting cast: the midfield is tighter than a gnat's chuff,. so good to see McLaren finally reviving, Gasly consistently punching above his weight, Ferrari having to earn every point and eat a bit of humble pie. Alonso, Vettel, Kimi all ex champions but struggling to make an impression. And next season could be... dare we hope... almost as good! Can't wait to see Russell in the Mercedes, quite possibly coming into conflict with team orders (specially if Hamilton comes off second best next weekend).
I was all over the place watching last night, screaming at the telly. Could barely watch at times. Got into a text fight with one of my best mates! Testosterone off the scale! Very undignified, but so lucky to have this battle to watch.
Next weekend could be another epic. Or it could be over at turn 1.
Wow.

I really hope Max doesn't use his current championship position to do a race ending manoeuvre, it would be a shame regardless of what the stewards would then have to decide in terms of championship winner. Yesterday was nerve racking but at the end of the day Lewis would probably have won even without the incident and Max being told to move over - his tyres would have given a good advantage at the end. I think the red flag rule needs refining though, maybe no changes allowed to the cars unless the weather has changed substantially between wet and dry.

If they did away with the street circuits, and returned to circuits where the gravel starts the other side of the stripey kerbs, we might see some drivers actually trying to keep the wheels between the white lines, and none of this nonsense... you fall off, you stay off with a radiator full of rocks.

But nonetheless, next week - and next year - look interesting.

If only it were possible to watch it legally in Germany without going via Sky

Never been one for F1 to be honest but after watching 'Drive to Survive' on Netflix I've changed my opinion. Probably one of the most compelling documentaries I've watched EVER. Intrigue, double dealing, driving gaffs but an appreciation of driving on the limit. Grosjean's escape from his fireball crash was as dramatic as it gets on TV .. Hopefully Flix will be doing a 2021 season

There will definitely be a Drive to Survive IV next spring before the season kicks off. F1 has highly tuned instincts when it comes to self publicity!
Drive to Survive is excellent in terms of entertainment and introducing F1 to a fresh audience - it's worked miracles in the traditionally F1-averse USA. But it does have some uncomfortable issues and it definitely has its agenda in terms of narrative.
Max Verstappen has already said he won't be involved in it because he believes it invents stories by selective editing.
That is undoubtedly true, but I can't help thinking Max would be better off on the inside, not the outside!

Well I'm sure they are going to paint him as the pantomime villain for this season, along with Christian Horner too. Been reading that CH said after the race that Max did not brake and have the telemetry to prove so, FIA report comes out saying Max did use the brakes to generated 69PSI & 2.4G of braking effort, CH then out with some more tribe saying yeah, he had slowed down a lot before using the brakes
You can take advantage of a VPN to a country where the F1TV app is allowed to stream the broadcast (E.G Poland) and then you can use Google Pay to pay for a monthly subscription to F1TV. Come race day, connect VPN to Poland and watch live. UK commentary is provided by Sky though, but do have other languages being broadcast too

It was certainly heck of a race and sets up quite a tense finale.

Alexis, I have a similar antipathy to Googlepay as I do to Sky... but I still have a UK address and bank account so I can do it from there (here!) I think. With a VPN.

In the meantime I'm getting by with frustrating ten minutes best-of from F1 on youtube.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...482655021073B064051D48265502&q=super max f1&shtp=GetUrl&shid=06d65175-3b4a-4c02-a781-43055914003f&shtk=UGl0c3RvcCBCb3lzIC0gU3VwZXIgTWF4IEYxIGZhbnMgTWF4IFZlcnN0YXBwZW4gKG9yZ2luZWxlIHZpZGVvKQ%3D%3D&shdk=VGhhbmtzIGd1eXMgZm9yIG1ha2luZyBvciBzb25nIG92ZXIgMy41MDAuMDAwIHZpZXdzISEhISBXZSBsb3ZlIHlvdSEhIFdlIHB1dCB0aGUgZW5nbGlzY2ggc29uZ3Rla3N0IGRvd24gYmVsb3chIFZvb3IgYWxsZSBmYW5zIHZhbiBNYXggVmVyc3RhcHBlbjogU1VQRVIgTUFYLiBTdHVkaW86IExvbmdzdHJlYW0gTWVkaWEgKE5pZWxzIExpbmdiZWVrKSBDYW1lcmE6IFRoaWpzIHZhbiBoZXQgUmV2ZSAmIEtldmluIFByaWVrYWFyIE1vbnRhZ2U6IFRSIEJyb2FkY2FzdGluZyBNZXQgZGFuayBhYW46IFR1Y2Nlci5ubCBLYXJ0YmFhbiBPbGRlbnphYWwgSGVucnkgRWxmZXJpbmsgSG9yZWNhZ29lZGVyZW4gLi4u&shhk=hpMvTGksL%2BDqpWqbTDo8v4vW2O8m0TtE0qjvkj1uZ%2B0%3D&form=VDSHOT&shth=OVP.JPlEZgPKUd4sWWh6yKmh9AHgFo

Channel 4 in the UK are now showing the race live Neil so that may work easier with a VPN?

Neil is in the UK this weekend Ashley.

Oh ok i take it he still widgeting with Joe in that case. Even easier to watch then

This phrase is a new one on me

I’m very jealous of my daughter being in the paddock at Yas Marina to take in all of the atmosphere and excitement. George Russell did a fabulous short video message to Eve’s consultant (who is a huge Merc F1 fan) thanking him for all that he does and for helping Eve.

Drive to Survive will be great too. Eve has to host them about as part of her job. She might be in a few bits too.

I am sure Neil will explain all

Edited that for you, Ashley

Oi! I resemble that remark!

I'm at Joe's today programming widgets, also testing on the important car (i.e. my 16V).

The combination of C4's broadcasts and our journey from Carlisle to Folkstone on Sunday make it unlikely though just possible that I will see even the best-of; it would have been nice if they'd shown the best of at say nine or ten

Another trip with no news reports, then!

Neil

Wow! How fantastic! Last I heard, she was working with Billy Monger - what's her current role?

She’s now press officer at Williams Racing - normally looking after Nicholas Latifi but also responsible for the young drivers programme too. It’s her dream job and she loves it. She’s the person with the dictaphone when the drivers are being interviewed (amongst other things)

Interesting that Michael Massi decided to clarify options were available to deduct championship points for unsportsmanlike behaviour etc if felt necessary ahead of tomorrow’s race.

If nothing else the teams are now on notice to hopefully prevent any 1st corner incident

How awesome! Congrats to Eve!

Thanks, Jim - I’m very proud of her getting the job. 600 applicants!

That is a fantastic feat. Rightly proud dad!

Back onto the championship decider...

Pole for Max after a tactical masterstroke by Red Bull - hats off. But will the soft tyres give him enough of a lead to negate Lewis' more sustainable pace on the mediums? My worry is that Perez will sacrifice himself and any points deduction to assist Max...

Well in such a case Michael Massi could decide to take points away from Perez and give them to Hamilton? However the ending has already been spoiled a bit with arbitrary points decisions...

What a total farce! This 2021 F1 Season has been littered in questionable decisions but that safety car call is the last straw.
The FIA have lost control and legitimacy in a single stroke.

Agree 100%,

There were several odd decisions today. Over the entire season, I reckon they evened out in terms of who they favoured.
Mercedes had no choice but to appeal (too much at stake not to), but the FIA will never overturn the decision (probably rightly).

The tough part is that you can't freeze the action while the stewards look at the VAR as you do in football or cricket, so the decisions are literally on the fly.
In my view, Merc lost the race by not pitting Lewis under the SC. But I'm very very glad it wasn't me making that call!
I wanted Lewis to win, but Max beat him in the end. Not a very satisfactory way to decide a race, never mind a championship, but pretty fitting for this insane season.
Roll on 2022.

Perhaps a red flag would have been the right decision in the circumstances

I think they lost legitimacy too — but when they didn’t penalise Hamilton when he left the track and didn’t get penalised
Also a fair result after Hamilton punted Max of in Sliverstone in a mega dangerous move he was never going to make — both drove well over the season but Max deserves the title — merc a superior car — Max the superior driver — but maybe just maybe I’m biased

I thought the decision on Lewis was fine - Max’s overtake left him absolutely nowhere to go but off. And the Silverstone thing was never “mega dangerous”. Both drivers were great this season. Lewis totally deserved to win that race though.

Don’t agree — Lewis left the door wide open for Max to come up the inside — he should have lost the place due to his bad driving and known Max would have jumped on his mistake and Martin Brundle even said — he will have to give that place back Verstappen stayed fully on the track and Hamilton made the mistaken

The incident at sileverstone was thee most dangerous manoeuvre the whole year ( and I don’t agree it WAS mega dangerous — max ended up
In hospital would it have been deemed mega dangerous if he had been seriously injured !! ) Hamilton would never have made that corner if he had not used Max as a buffer totally wrong line at a ridiculous speed go on a track and try it impossible line to take that corner and stay on the track —and again in the words of Martin Brundle if he was playing football he would have been sent off — wether he drove well after it or not a 10 second penalty was ridiculous

I’m neither a Verstappen or Hamilton fan so not blinkered the best season (even if not always the fairest ) for a long time needed the raw talent of Max to wake up a sport where Hamilton has gone relatively unchallenged and in the best car for the past 7 years Red Bull knew they couldn’t beat them
In a straight scrap so had to ‘play the game ‘ in a way that suited them — as many football managers have to do Hamilton winged and moaned all season because another team was not playing by ‘his’ rules — the last race was exiting but not the way the championship should have been decided but Max got the most out of his car all season and in the end I think not only deserved the title more than Hamilton but drove better than him
All change for next season but if Hamilton doesn’t know what to expect by now — time to start knitting Max is no more or less dangerous a driver than Senna or Schumacher et all where

I just wish the rest of the teams can catch up with Merc in terms of performance— they we can really see how good Hamilton really is — now that would be good racing

I totally respect Martin Brundle’s views but his are just one of a number of very experienced drivers on this. Far from all agree with him

I’m nowhere near as experienced as MB but I have done +/- 100 races myself. Max’s form of driving is extremely aggressive - he basically throws his car into situations where he challenges the other driver to back out or crash. Frankly, like BTCC, it pi55es me off to see this type of driving because it filters down to other levels of the sport.

In Abu Dhabi, he threw it up the inside leaving Hamilton nowhere to go but off. It not “bad driving” from Lewis (Max was miles back) but ultra aggressive driving by Max. It’s why Lewis wasn’t penalised.

Silverstone was in some ways similar - both drivers were on the edge but there’s plenty of room in Copse for two cars to pass side-by-side - but Max took an aggressive line and Lewis ran slightly wide and they touched. It’s a very fast corner like many in F1 and it ended badly for Max. I’ve both overtaken in Copse and been overtaken. Max could have given Lewis more room but that’s not his style. Lewis got the penalty for running slightly wide but it wasn’t mega dangerous driving by Lewis - nothing close.

If you’re not a Mac fan, you’re doing a very good job of sounding like one. You haven’t mentioned the 3 penalties Max got in Jeddah - or him running over Lewis at Monza, or running Lewis off the road in Brazil - all of which could have been “mega dangerous” except Lewis doesn’t drive anywhere near as aggressively as Max so avoids most of the crashes.

Max is a great talent and great for the sport - can’t wait to see George Russell and him in similar machines. But the outcome of the race on Sunday was straightforwardly wrong.

yup as I said "not the way the championship should have been decided '

yes, but sorry Martin Brundle is one of the most respected and experienced commentators in F1 and regarded as the new voice of F1 since the passing of Murray .... on both points he got a agreement from fellow commentators ,in Brazil they both totally outbraked themselves into a massive run of area , easily shown by steering wheel angles , yes I have also raced many many times also ( err was many many years ago in a Westfield 7 )

at Silverstone Max took the recognised racing line ,Lewis knew fine well what he was doing ... Max at Monza was bang out of order , but simply getting Lewis back for Silverstone , it was like this all season , I was nearly mentioning cases from a non Hamilton point of view, but you lot being English view him through rose tinted glasses ,so I was basically throwing in a different point of view .
they are both great drivers , but I think Hamilton has had the best car for the best part of 7 years and yes he has made the most of it , but I also think if you had put Alonso .Leclerc , Verstappen , et al in the same car you would have got the same outcome ... as Mr Russell very nearly shown when he got his chance in it .

Hamilton has done a fantastic job in a great car and team , it took a rawer style of driving ...and an obvious relaxation of the way the rules have ben interpreted , to make the season what it was ,instead of what had become a very much , 'oh please you first sir' attitude towards overtaking because of a stifling interpretation of the rules on racing which had gone before and killing F1 by making it a procession and total boredom , and no I don't condone wheel banging touring car driving , but there has to be a middle ground in my opinion ...role on next year

Totally agree.

As for Mr Brundle he's like a flag dancing in the wind - A week ago he said:



He's been hugely critical of the sport throughout a season that he is now suggesting is the best F1 season ever!

For me the end of this race looked like blatant race manipulation. No amount of "the Race Director can choose which rules he applies" makes it any better, it actually makes it worse, as have all the inconsistent penalties being applied over the last few years. It has to be accepted that the manipulation made the ending more "entertaining" and gave the title to the plucky entertaining youngster. But this is supposed to be a sport, not an engineered drama series, I guess the fact F1 is owned by a media company & the sale of media rights to Netflix etc has more influence over the outcome than what happens between the start lights and the finishing flag! It will be interesting to see how this season affects sponsorship and vehicle manufacturer involvement. Will VW buy in or simply walk away?

only comment to make

it's supposed to be a sport ....it was 40 years ago .............its now a big business plain and simple , wrapped around a 'sport ' , and we all agree we didn't want the season to end like it did, the crucial part I don't understand is why he didn't allow all the back markers to go past the safety car, we wouldn't be having this discussion if he did , I don't think it was for financial or business gains , the race end had been dramatic enough to keep every fan and casual viewer enthralled , I believe he wanted to end the season with a great finish rather than a safety car ending , but we will never know what the real influence on him made him decide that was the preferred option ,one team principle saying you cant do this ,the other team principle saying otherwise I don't think Hamilton winning or max winning after all that had happened would have been detrimental to the spectacle it truly was , doubt we will ever know

I think the fact was that they realised that if they had waited for all the cars to have us lapped themselves the safety car would likely have missed the pit lane entry point and no last lap stitch up would have been possible.

It is still as much of a sport as it ever was with teams grasping every advantage that they can whether legal or not. In those days, the price may have been the driver’s life - these days it’s sponsors. I know which I prefer.

Anyone but the English, heh? I lived in the Highlands for 15 years - I know the game.

Your point about Silverstone and the “racing line” flies totally in the face of your admiration for Max’s overtake at Abu Dhabi which had nothing to do with any “racing line”. If you did race, it must have been bizarre.

Brazil Lewis would have made the corner had Max not done another stupidly aggressive move. EVERYBODY seems to accept that FIA screwed up completely in their decisions and that has been referred to by so many people since. Even FIA said it was no longer acceptable. And, if Max is petty enough to be paying anybody back for anything, he has no place in F1 let along as world champion.

I think Max is a great driver but he drives like an Amsterdammer - “I don’t care what you do just do long as you don’t get in my way”. He’s been in so many stewards situations because he drives like he does - but he can’t see that.

Ultimately it is FIA who need to carry the can - they aren’t managing the situation well enough.

So not only questioning if I’m telling the truth slagging me off
Thought we where having a decent conversation

Obviously I was wrong — sad person
No further input

Aye, I agree, I’m not going to comment of todays F1, I’m old school and watched in the 60s and 70s very dangerous back then, but it was far more entertaining in my view, perhaps wrong to say that but scrapes and accidents did make things interesting. Money plays a major part that’s obvious, especially so today. Mrs what’s with the 15 years in the Highlands and you know how to play the game, anybody apart from the English!!!!!!!! where did that come from on here.? Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but forcing your thoughts at a members ridicule is not doing your point of view any favours.

Sorry if I upset you but I’m trying to match what you’re saying with racing - especially your comments on Silverstone.

Wow, that escalated quickly!

Don't be so sensitive, Paul, I don't think Max would have flounced at that comment.

In fairness, you were the one that mentioned a) being biased and b) saying that "you lot" see Hamilton through tinted glasses because we're English.
I've witnessed plenty of ABE in my time and it does look quite a bit like it!

I read the "English" comment wondering what might ensue, but in fairness also noted a after it which I interpreted as a poke of fun - which is something we can tolerate on here.

Reading the thread from the beginning was good education for me as I don't follow F1 but I now feel qualified to spout on this topic after reading the many exchanges.

It's been a while too since the forum had a healthy debate like this so all we need is some other current controversy to keep on track...ohhh......perhaps I shouldn't have said that

I’m a bit surprised at the anti English insinuations. In all fairness this type of engagement is mostly fuelled by the press, especially rags like the Sun. When I was working as a welder in the yards, I would pick up a Sun newspaper that was lying about and the sheer anti English statements were shocking. Now I remember visiting a friend down in Bournemouth and we had a big fry up breakfast at one of the cafes. Sun newspaper on the table and it was all anti Scottish nonsense. That was back in the 90s. Who the hell buys this crap.

I think it’s safe to say on both north and south of the border there are some nutters who fly their flag too vigorously shall we say, but I really haven’t heard anything for some time. Under the circumstances we all need to get on with each other more than ever.

“I think it’s safe to say on both north and south of the border there are some nutters who fly their flag too vigorously shall we say, but I really haven’t heard anything for some time. Under the circumstances we all need to get on with each other more than ever. [/quote]”

Have to agree with you Jimboy. F1 has become very polarised which is understandable to a point in respect to team / driver support but the one common message that has been delivered before each race has been “We race as One”
I have to say it’s something that F1 can be proud of but clearly the commercial pressures are such even racing in Saudi & Qatar with their human rights record seem to have have progressed with limited comment.

Jimboy - I wholeheartedly agree with you. Division between Nations (whether England/Scotland or any other combination) is usually driven by politics and money, using the media as the delivery system.
I read far too many F1 websites and blogs and it has been very apparent that a substantial majority encourage the polarisation between Max and Lewis as rage/clickbait.
What's more, most of the sites based outside the UK, angle their stories towards Max and against Lewis, which is understandable. It's usually only in the comment columns that the base tribal insults appear.
To be fair, it's not difficult to nurture anti-English sentiment when it comes to sport: the unforgivable behaviour of a shameful number of "fans" during the Euros gave anyone who wanted it a fantastic amount of fuel for that fire. And although the vast majority of genuine supporters behaved just fine, we will be judged by the worst.
Living in France for almost 20 years, watching all kinds of sport in my local (Irish) bar, I've seen and heard so much "Anyone But England" attitude that I know this is true.
If you combine that with the desire for change that a lot of F1 fans that don't follow Lewis will naturally feel (I remember that feeling when Schumacher was in his pomp), then you shouldn't be surprised that some people put it all together and become implacably polarised.

I think the common ground here is that it was an incredible, dramatic championship fought between two brilliant but contrasting drivers that deserved to be decided in a less contentious way.

I feel privileged to have watched it unfold and I'm absolutely buzzing for next year.

just too clear up ..at no time did I question if you had actually raced or a 'story' I took you at your word , I never made any personal comments , on how I imagine you drive , as I said earlier, I was just throwing in a different point of view, and enjoying peoples views on the what happened on Sunday , and the current state of F1 , at no time did I get personal , and I see no reason for anybody else to !

and yes Jim the 'English' comment was purely a bit of fun , to keep things light, hence the ( didn't appear to work ) ,I actually have Italians parents and passport ,so who am I to comment , and also my son in law is English , and we have had great banter/chats about Hamilton / Verstappen or even England v Italy euro final , so I think any chat about, the papers ,England - Scotland ,biased, etc is way overboard , crikey where are we if cant have a bit of fun ,

Good write up Jim.

Just to add, I’m a very proud Scot, it’s kind of ingrained in me like others in Scotland and believe it or not, I can trace my heritage back to Culioden and the 1745. The history of Scotland is peppered with stories of intrigue myth and reality. Romance ,cruelty in the mix. I do get a bit passionate about where I live, at times I can’t explain my feelings it’s one of those things. Scotland is just one of those places. Amazing scenery to boot, ach there I go again, stop Jim.

To get back to the main topic. Dutchy here with a lot of F1 fans around me, including those who saw the race in Abu Dhabi. Of course we are biased towards Max. Because he is Dutch (sort of) and because he is the underdog. But in my surroundings including me Hamilton is held in high regards, for his racing and for behaviour outside the race. In my opinion Max was lucky but took his chance and the decisions by the referees were defendable though debatable. Hamilton was quicker in this race. Though during the year, both had chances to create a gap between them.

jaaps2 - good to get your perspective - and of course the Dutch (and Belgians?) are right to be proud of Max.
It's refreshing to hear that Lewis it's held in high esteem for his racing and other work.
I think the booing that has followed both drivers around the world has been really disappointing and does not reflect the way true F1 fans behave.

Personally, the people who ground my gears this year were Horner and Marko, who came across as bitter and grubby.
They clearly, from the outset, had a strategy of aggressively briefing against anyone and everything that stood in the way of Max's title bid (as uncompromising as Max's driving you might say).
However, this eventually triggered a similar (if classier) response from Wolff and Mercedes, which ended up making it a sordid and devalued spectacle, fought in the stewards' room rather than on track.
The irony is that I believe that Red Bull are the best on the grid at making on the fly and brilliant strategy calls, and may well have won the championship in a much better way by keeping their mouths shut and winding their necks in.

My take is that under pressure at the end Michael Masi made a very bad decision. We had an interesting season with two drivers from different teams battling throughout - a great situation. It was set up perfectly with even points for them going into the last race, but one of them having a slight upper hand having won mor e races (although I'm not sure 2 laps behind a safety car can be called a race...). The timing of the last safety car meant that by the most commonly applied rule the race would finish under the yellow flag which would be a disappointment. So as race director Masi tried to ensure a racing lap. He had an alternative in the rule book to finishing behind the safety car, that of not letting lapped cars pass. He said that would happen and immediately Christian Whinger Spice got on the radio to him and said the lapped cars needed to be let past, in the heat of the moment Masi bent to that request in a way not in the rule book and Red Bull got their miracle. Without that Lewis would have won behind the safety car. If the lapped cars hadn't been let past (which is allowed in the rule book) Max would have had to pass the lapped cars, who would be obliged to make it easy for him, before catching Lewis, possibly setting up an end of lap battle Max might have won. But instead, the win was handed to Max on a plate due to the tyre advantage he had.

In terms of the tyre advantage the second of two cars always has the benefit of hindsight in that situation - they can do the opposite of what the leader does. Mercedes had no way of having that hindsight and would have lost track position by pitting Lewis with the race then finishing behind the safety car and everyone talking about them making the most catastrophic strategy move ever. In racing there are knowns and there are variables, the rules should never be the variables, but on Sunday they were.

I really don't want the championship decided anywhere but the track, however, I do feel Mercedes have no choice but to take this to appeal because it is the only way to ensure that rules won't be the variables in the future - without that clarity F1 loses.

A good summary andyps, and I like the name "Christian Whinger Spice" Brilliant! Another thing I thought was odd was that when they finally started racing again on the final lap, Max was pretty much level with Lewis rather than being in a clear gap behind (not that it would have made any difference). A disappointing end for sure, ruined only by on-the-spot rule changes (I would have been happy for Max to win if he had been in the lead during that final safety car period)

I was taught when doing my race licence qualification at Knockhill that “level isn’t overtaking” so, whilst you shouldn’t fall back too far, provided you don’t actually overtake (get your nose ahead - which Merc claimed Max did) you can draw level.

I loved Whinger Spice too

F1 is now a total farce and no longer a sport

Ferrari should be protesting the result as well as Mercedes - Masi handed Hamilton to Max on a plate by removing all the lapped cars, but no such advantage was given to Sainz. Aa result Max didn’t need to worry about any challenge from behind, making his already ridiculously easy overtake even easier….

Who knows, Sainz might have thrown one up the inside and taken the race win, but we’ll never know as it wasn’t a level playing field

As for not wanting the race to finish under the safety car, did anyone watch the race at Spa??? Two laps under the safety car and we’ll award half points - total joke and contributed to Mercedes being hamstrung on strategy in the last race due to Max having more ‘wins’

Against any other driver Mercedes would have pitted Hamilton and not worried too much about track position as they knew Lewis’ superior pace would win out. Of course with Crashstappen to overtake, and knowing a crash gives him WDC, that was far too risky.

Protocol should have been followed, article 48.12 provides for ALL lapped cars to unlap themselves, that would have taken them into lap 57, safety car in at end of lap, race ‘restarts’ when the lead car crosses the finish line (which of course it wouldn’t as it would be the end of the race)

If there is ever a next time, I hope Toto tells the 2nd Mercedes’ to simply park on the apex of a corner, thus preventing the safety car being called in……

There is a very interesting legal analysis of the rules applied (or not) here - https://medium.com/@gwkj1/analysing...-prix-a-lawyers-perspective-571ca3810060

Interesting piece that and it begs the question as to how the FIA placate Mercedes without looking like fools in the process. I can’t see how they can avoid sticking with the current outcome without getting themselves into legal wrangles that may impact next season and all the fall out that goes with it.

Mercedes have withdrawn their appeal (as was always likely), based on reassurances from the FIA that they will conduct a thorough enquiry into what happened and prevent it happening again. Not looking good for Masi, I suspect.

Very importantly, Mercedes have issued a statement accepting the result and congratulating Red Bull and Max. This allows everyone to move on to changing the system so that this situation cannot arise again.

I've struggled to understand why the teams have access to the race director in the way we've seen and heard this year.
It's like footballers surrounding the ref. Adding drama for entertainment maybe, but we've seen why it doesn't work.

The contact should be one way: if the race director asks you for your input, you give it, then shut up.

At most, teams should be able to submit a request for their opinion to be considered.

All communications can be recorded and released post race to preserve transparency, but there is absolutely no need for teams to pressure officials.

But Max did get ahead of Lewis albeit briefly, but the FIA said due to the way they were speeding up and slowing down, then no penalty was given, which I get, but surely what is the point in having rules saying you shouldn't over take a car under the safety car.

Also, I've seen salty spice been given to Christian too

I'm glad in some ways to see the appeal withdrawn - mainly because the championship shouldn't be decided away from the track. I'm not optimistic about the FIA thorough inquiry, however, after their statement last night that effectively blamed fans and others for the confusion. As well as a new race director I can't help feeling they need a new communications director too!

Once I saw that FIA had admitted that things weren’t ideal, I was sure Mercedes would withdraw their appeal. A change in outcome wasn’t going to sit well and Mercedes have the moral high ground. I can hear Hamilton being described as “the 7x world champ - should have been 8x”. I too would be surprised if Masi isn’t sacrificed in this. He needed a sidekick like Charlie W had. And, yes, they should stop the access.

The huge elephant in the room is that as was pointed out earlier: F1 is no longer about which team is capable of building and driving a faster car, but on maximising the cash inflow to the owners. And that helps no-one but the owners.

was it REALLY any different?

I think it has always been that way, the figures involved have escalated alarmingly, but income has always related to success and success has always related to income. The cost cap may be very interesting in terms of how that could change, especially if new teams are allowed.

I suspect that in the pre-Ecclestone days, the F1 association was there to manage facilities for races, organise the rules, and provide some small prize money for the teams. There was the traditional approach of 'win on Sunday, sell cars on Monday'... but these days the F1 exists in and of itself.

yes totally agree , far far more than before , obviously money has always "came into ' the equation , I think for the past 10-20 years money 'is' the equation , and yes as a Ferrari fan that suited them ( and err me ) , but hopefully the cap will help bring some smaller teams into F! and freshen it up , wether they will be able to compete or not is anther matter .. certainly seems to be a few good drivers coming tho , to fill any drives Oscar Piastri for one.

on the Ferrari note , I was more than surprised at Carlos's showing in the car in his 1st season , I thought Leclerc , would have bossed him a bit, but most certainly not the case, very impressed by him

Two incredibly fit men and wonderful drivers.

But I support the one who doesn't have a vegetarian dog.

There's an old joke in F1:
Q: How do you become a millionaire through formula one?
A: Start off as a billionaire

The budgets are so colossal that even most manufacturers struggle to justify an F1 programme, particularly at a time when everyone's heads are turned towards electricity.
So where does that leave the plucky, less corporate teams?
Williams hung on as a privateer for too long and although it was emotional, it wasn't pretty. Thankfully, it looks as though the team has a brighter future now.
I'm amazed Gene Haas hasn't pulled the plug, but if 2022 doesn't bring some success, I reckon he'll go.
And if Lawrence Stroll can make Aston a financial success on or off the track, I'll be very impressed.
Long story short, you need very very deep pockets to play at this table. Not to mention the ability to attract engineers who are borderline genius as well as drivers who are supremely talented on the track and marketing gold off it.
A few decades ago, the prize fund contributed a sizeable proportion of a team's budget - and Ferrari twisted the FIAs arm into the most outrageously unjust division of the spoils, based on the dubious proposition that F1 needed Ferrari more than vice versa. I think the last few seasons have demonstrated the fallacy of that - whatever the historical situation.
But these days, the multi-million dollar partnerships that all teams have embraced are what literally keep the wheels turning. Sponsorship and marketing owns the sport (like most others at the top level), but I'm not sure it reduces the on track drama.
Will the cost cap change the game? I think it depends on how good the players are at bending the rules. And F1 teams are experts at that.

Zac Brown has said that the cost cap could lead to billion dollar teams - with the amount of sponsorship some of them generate and limited ability to spend it we could be heading towards teams having value similar to football clubs in future. Gives Gene Haas very good reason to stay.