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Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1671705
29/04/2024 22:00
29/04/2024 22:00
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 17,038
Auld Reekie
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Auld Reekie
Admirable patience!


BumbleBee carer smile
Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion #1671714
30/04/2024 08:37
30/04/2024 08:37
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296
Sandhurst
Begbie Offline OP
Ex El Presidente
Begbie  Offline OP
Ex El Presidente
I AM a Coop

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,296
Sandhurst
Discussion thread


Originally Posted by Jonny - After being taken out at Spa
Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: Begbie] #1671715
30/04/2024 09:03
30/04/2024 09:03
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 17,038
Auld Reekie
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Originally Posted by Begbie
Discussion thread


Oops, sorry!


BumbleBee carer smile
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: Begbie] #1671717
30/04/2024 10:01
30/04/2024 10:01
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,227
FCSS 01684 593187
Countrycruising Offline
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FCSS 01684 593187
What's the rest of the spec on the build now your pistons have arrived?

Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1671743
01/05/2024 10:37
01/05/2024 10:37
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 76
Used to be a regular
G
Gurmon Offline
Reaping the fruits
Gurmon  Offline
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G

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 76
Used to be a regular
Good news, I was wondering what happened to this coupe not that long ago. Looking forward to hearing more.


Coop gone, not forgotton. Audi B6 S4
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: Begbie] #1671768
02/05/2024 15:01
02/05/2024 15:01
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
C
CanadianCoupe Offline
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Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
Hi Joe,

The spec will be the same as was except for the slightly bigger bore. Maybe that'll change in the future but for now I want to get it running. I still need to get it registered in Texas and I think I'm being fined every month that it's not registered after importing it. I can't register it without an inspection and insurance so I need to get it driveable first.

I'll try and update the spec on my web site over the weekend, there are a couple of items that are out of date.

Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA - Discussion [Re: Begbie] #1671769
02/05/2024 15:09
02/05/2024 15:09
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
C
CanadianCoupe Offline
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C

Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
One of the fun things about living in Houston is that there is a LOT of money here.

My friend bought his client's vehicle over to show me last night. This is what happens when you throw several $100,000 at a Land Rover Defender 130.

Attached Files
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Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672637
29/06/2024 08:34
29/06/2024 08:34
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 740
Cleveland
P
PaulL Offline
Club Member 1872, Regional Rep N.E.
PaulL  Offline
Club Member 1872, Regional Rep N.E.
Enjoying the ride
P

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 740
Cleveland
Thanks for keeping us updated with progress

Keep it up

Paul

Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672746
02/07/2024 22:32
02/07/2024 22:32
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 17,038
Auld Reekie
Edinburgh Offline
Club President, member225
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Auld Reekie
Your tenacity in looking for the elusive/extinct brake master cylinder is much appreciated John, it would be amazing if you found something. I know experts here have torn their hair out in their quests....


BumbleBee carer smile
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672754
03/07/2024 15:37
03/07/2024 15:37
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
Making a profit
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Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
Re the VW Jetta cylinder. Would it be possible to use something like this https://www.merlinmotorsport.co.uk/p/twin-remote-reservoir-with-switch-pb000191

Or is it the case that the fittings on the cylinder prohibit running lines to the reservoir?


E85
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: clanger] #1672761
03/07/2024 18:32
03/07/2024 18:32
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
C
CanadianCoupe Offline
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Houston, Texas, USA
The cylinder has two holes in the top into which the brake fluid enters. These have rubber plugs in them with a hole in the middle. On the FIAT (LHD or RHD) a 90 degree plastic pipe is inserted into the rubber plug. The other end of this pipe is connected to the rubber hose that goes to the remote brake fluid reservoir.

The problem is that with either the LHD FIAT cylinder or the VW cylinder the hole in the rubber grommet is larger and the plastic pipe won't stay put. For the LHD FIAT this is due to using a different sized plastic pipe. For the VW this is caused by the reservoir tank plugging directly into the cylinder. The LHD FIAT plastic pipes are no longer available. If I'm to use either of these cylinders I have to find another source for these larger diameter pipes.

I had a look on ebay and there is only one used LHD FIAT cylinder available. It is in very poor condition but I'd only want it for the plastic pipes. They should work but shipping to USA is about $70 and I'm looking for a easier to source solution that would also work for other owners who may end up in the same situation:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/4048352496...EO&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

I've checked and the pipes used by older FIAT puntos and Bravos that use a remote reservoir are still available. Most modern implementations are plugging the reservoir directly into the cylinder. This makes sense in that there are less connections and parts. I'm going to order a pair of each on the chance that they are larger diameter.

Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 03/07/2024 18:40.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672762
03/07/2024 19:24
03/07/2024 19:24
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
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Free State of Jones
Ah, gotcha. If the cylinder rubber plugs are removed does this leave two smooth bored holes?


E85
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: clanger] #1672763
03/07/2024 19:55
03/07/2024 19:55
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline
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Joined: Aug 2023
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Houston, Texas, USA
These pictures might help explain the problem better, They show the rusty RHD FIAT cylinder and the new shiny LHD FIAT cylinder with yellow plugs.

The plastic pipe has a OD of about 8mm but the hole in the middle of the grommet for the LHD FIAT or VW is more like 12mm.

Yes the bores are smooth so an alternative might be to find a rubber grommet that fits into the hole in the LHD FIAT or VW cylinder but with an 8mm hole in the middle to fit the plastic pipe from the RHD FIAT.

Attached Files
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1000018706.jpg (73 downloads)
Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 03/07/2024 19:57.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672764
03/07/2024 20:49
03/07/2024 20:49
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
Making a profit
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Free State of Jones
Originally Posted by CanadianCoupe


Yes the bores are smooth so an alternative might be to find a rubber grommet that fits into the hole in the LHD FIAT or VW cylinder but with an 8mm hole in the middle to fit the plastic pipe from the RHD FIAT.


Putting aside the issue of swarf, for me the ideal solution would be to plug tap those holes and fit threaded barb fittings with thread seal and then plumb to a suitable new reservoir, difficult perhaps but I don't think impossible. Alternatively a rubber grommet or O ring could also work providing it is held firmly in place by the suitably rigid pipe insert.

What is the part number of the VW cylinder?


E85
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: clanger] #1672765
03/07/2024 21:08
03/07/2024 21:08
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
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CanadianCoupe Offline
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
If you search for "VW Jetta 1993-1999 Brake Master Cylinder" you'll find lots of matches.

for example: Metalli 357611019A

I think the actual VW part number is 357611019B. It fits any of the following:

Golf 89-99
Jetta 89-99
Passat 95-97
Corrado 90-94
EuroVan 93-95


Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 03/07/2024 21:09.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672767
04/07/2024 08:08
04/07/2024 08:08
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
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Free State of Jones
Thanks. I have been thinking some more;

Before plastic became the preferred material those little parts would of been made out of brass. In a similar vein to where the oil cooler pipes enter the sandwich plate and are sealed with an O ring, a shouldered brass insert with with O ring and either a barb or threaded stub as a take off could easily be produced by someone with a small lathe. The ideal person would be someone who makes model steam engines as it is similar in scale and they produce such parts as a matter of course.

I think you are already more than half way there in finding a replacement cylinder that physically fits.


E85
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672769
04/07/2024 10:36
04/07/2024 10:36
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 17,038
Auld Reekie
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Auld Reekie
If a workable solution emerges from this interesting exchange then it could be something the Club might like to support for the benefit of owners.


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Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672773
04/07/2024 12:48
04/07/2024 12:48
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
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Free State of Jones
"Nothing new under the sun"

This link describes what I have in mind, groove sizes and O ring to be spec'ed obviously:

https://www.carbuilder.com/us/sierra-master-cylinder-brass-remote-reservoir-adapter


E85
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: Begbie] #1672774
04/07/2024 13:12
04/07/2024 13:12
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,052
ation
szkom Offline
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Forum is my life

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ation
Question: why is the LHD cylinder longer? It may make the car undrivable if it causes the brakes to grab or such

Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: szkom] #1672777
04/07/2024 18:16
04/07/2024 18:16
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
C
CanadianCoupe Offline
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Posts: 32
Houston, Texas, USA
Something similar to that brass item in the link would work except that on the FIAT the outlet needs to be at 90 degrees because the remote reservoir brake lines come in from the side not the top. I'm looking at alternative plastic fittings to make it as easy as possible to convert.

I think the LHD FIAT cylinder is longer only due to the design. As long as the internal cylinder is the same diameter (7/8") then the amount of fluid pushed down the brake lines should be the same for the same pedal movement. 7/8" = 0.875" = 22.2mm

Last edited by CanadianCoupe; 04/07/2024 18:19.
Re: Fiat Coupe 20VT in USA [Re: CanadianCoupe] #1672781
04/07/2024 21:46
04/07/2024 21:46
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
clanger Offline
Making a profit
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Posts: 314
Free State of Jones
Originally Posted by CanadianCoupe
I'm looking at alternative plastic fittings to make it as easy as possible to convert.


Yes simplest solution.


E85

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