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#1537060 - 07/05/2015 13:10 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Gimmo Offline
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 23/08/2013
Posts: 479
Loc: North Italy
Nigel, do you have any idea about the finale price of these discs?
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#1537137 - 07/05/2015 22:36 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Gimmo]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: Gimmo
Nigel, do you have any idea about the finale price of these discs?


The discs are available as a set (with rear discs and front pads) for about £330

I sold my rear discs and front pads to get some of the money back

If you're lucky enough to already have aftermarket hubs, you'll simply need the 0.5mm shim

If you have original hubs, you'll need to have them machined, or fit aftermarket hubs - either route will require new wheel bearings
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#1538967 - 23/05/2015 22:40 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Got my Coupe back today - floating discs fitted and seemingly working fine

I tried a few moderately hard stops on the way home and then took the wheels off to see if the spacing shims had moved - still where they were supposed to be, so I'll try a few monster stops to see if they can stand some proper abuse

First impressions are very good - the discs are silent (unlike the grooved MTecs that have just been taken off) and the feels seems to be better

Most importantly though, they look amazing.... wink

click to enlarge click to enlarge
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#1538969 - 23/05/2015 22:52 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
knight7660 Offline
Competition Level

Registered: 16/12/2007
Posts: 2237
Loc: Windsor/ Reading
They look spot on Nigel how's the braking difference have you had a change to put them through some testing yet?
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#1538983 - 24/05/2015 02:03 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Sedicivalvole Offline
Club member 147
Forum is my life

Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 6546
Loc: Northampton England
Watching this with great interest smile
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#1538993 - 24/05/2015 10:25 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
H_R Offline
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Registered: 30/07/2012
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They look awesome! thumb

Are these standard size just skimmed the older posts cant see any reference except 330mm but now i cant remember if standard is 305mm or 330mm??
just too early for me probably!

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#1538996 - 24/05/2015 10:53 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
knight7660 Offline
Competition Level

Registered: 16/12/2007
Posts: 2237
Loc: Windsor/ Reading
Standard size if I remember rightly. wink and yes to early my brains not fully working yet
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#1539007 - 24/05/2015 12:01 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
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Loc: Staffordshire
Standard size - 305 x 28

They are the wrong pcd - 4 x 100 instead of 4 x 98, but because the bolt holes are bigger, they fit without having to open the holes

The only issues is the 59mm centre bore (against the Coupe's 58.1mm) - I have used a 0.5mm shim and it seems to work

If I could find Abarth 695 floating discs, I would have used them, as they are a perfect fit - 4x98, 305 x 28 and 58.1 centre bore
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#1539009 - 24/05/2015 12:09 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
H_R Offline
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Registered: 30/07/2012
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Originally Posted By: Nigel
Standard size - 305 x 28

They are the wrong pcd - 4 x 100 instead of 4 x 98, but because the bolt holes are bigger, they fit without having to open the holes

The only issues is the 59mm centre bore (against the Coupe's 58.1mm) - I have used a 0.5mm shim and it seems to work

If I could find Abarth 695 floating discs, I would have used them, as they are a perfect fit - 4x98, 305 x 28 and 58.1 centre bore


Yes i just went looking for some cannot find any now as im certain that partsworld had a load for fiat 500 for around £500 or perhaps it was for the punto and im thinking of 500 abarth alloys for £500

The abarth 500 brake kit is around £2000 but i think that includes the brembo calipers?

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#1539015 - 24/05/2015 13:20 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: H_R]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: H_R
The abarth 500 brake kit is around £2000 but i think that includes the brembo calipers?


Correct

I can get the 500 695 floating discs for £500 + VAT (£600) which is still a decent price for a low-volume two piece disc setup
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#1539023 - 24/05/2015 16:16 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Jimbo Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 9705
Loc: Gone
Have you put these in water to see if they really do float or is it just hype?
laugh

They look great Nigel, good job.

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#1539062 - 24/05/2015 21:07 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Sedicivalvole Offline
Club member 147
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Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 6546
Loc: Northampton England
So a direct bolt on set of floating discs is £500 + VAT?

How much of an improvement will this make to cooling do you think Nigel?
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#1539063 - 24/05/2015 21:33 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Sedicivalvole]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: Sedicivalvole
So a direct bolt on set of floating discs is £500 + VAT?

How much of an improvement will this make to cooling do you think Nigel?


If you can find them, yes

The only issue may be the diameter of your hub flange - OE appears to be wrong, but aftermarket seems to be capable of taking the floating disc

Too early to tell about performance, but the initial feel is very encouraging (although that's always the case when you fit new stuff like brakes or tyres - the new stuff feels like a big improvement)


Edited by Nigel (24/05/2015 21:36)
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#1539094 - 25/05/2015 01:40 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Sedicivalvole Offline
Club member 147
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Registered: 17/12/2005
Posts: 6546
Loc: Northampton England
Thanks Nigel,

Get out on the road and test them smile I'll be up for a pair if they help the cooling and brake feel
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#1539176 - 25/05/2015 22:41 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Nigel Offline
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Been out today and given the brakes a decent hammering (repeated big stops to bed in the Pagid yellow pads) - the spacing shim has stayed put (although I'm going to modify the design a bit) and the feel is much improved over the previous brakes (MTec and Ferodo DS2500)

I have a feeling that once the wheel is bolted on, the disc simply cannot move, so the spacing shim is more of a locating device, rather than taking any kind of load

Overall, I'm very pleased with them, although because of having to change the hubs (and thus the bearings), the cost wasn't as attractive as it first looked

Its definitely worth having your wheels off and measuring your hub flanges - if they are the smaller aftermarket size, these discs will be a pretty cheap, but highly desirable upgrade
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#1540497 - 05/06/2015 00:39 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Gimmo Offline
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 23/08/2013
Posts: 479
Loc: North Italy
Nigel, is there any possibility to make a group buy for the complete set?
Spacer and discs?
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#1540561 - 05/06/2015 14:51 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Gimmo]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: Gimmo
Nigel, is there any possibility to make a group buy for the complete set?
Spacer and discs?


I'll have a look into it, but I think there may be a supply issue - I don't think there are very many sets of discs around
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#1540616 - 06/06/2015 02:42 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
andyps Offline
Club member 1482
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 1149
Loc: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
If the absolute correct size are for the 695 I guess it will be a while before they are available, the car is very new to the market and probably only sold in very limited numbers so won't be much about - there isn't even a brochure available for the car yet!
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#1540638 - 06/06/2015 13:32 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Gimmo Offline
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 23/08/2013
Posts: 479
Loc: North Italy
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#1544429 - 12/07/2015 23:35 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Gimmo]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Another update.....

I got lucky and found a set of worn-out discs from a 500 Abarth 695

I paid £40 for both discs and I've had a chance to try them on a Coupe hub - perfect fit laugh - 4x98 and 59.1mm centre bore (edit - not 58.1 - see below)

click to enlarge click to enlarge

So, I'm now looking for aftermarket brake rotors - I've found a place that will make them up from Brembo blanks - just got to give them the dimensions and negotiate a price

While I'm talking to them, I'll probably look into the cost of having disc centres made as well

Great news for my own brakes, but not good for general availability, as worn-out 695 brakes are hardly commonplace...



Edited by Nigel (13/07/2015 15:09)
Edit Reason: edited centre bore size
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#1544430 - 12/07/2015 23:51 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
knight7660 Offline
Competition Level

Registered: 16/12/2007
Posts: 2237
Loc: Windsor/ Reading
So what's going on with the set you have fitted Nigel
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#1544431 - 12/07/2015 23:55 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: knight7660]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: knight7660
So what's going on with the set you have fitted Nigel


Nothing - they are behaving perfectly (other than the drilled holes are almost full of dust now...), but I always knew that the Punto Abarth discs were only a 99% perfect solution, so I'm continuing to explore the options - TBH, I could easily fit the existing rotors to my 695 hubs and I'd be fully sorted, but I want to see if I can find a solution for everyone else too
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#1544461 - 13/07/2015 12:01 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
BTW - I also found out that the standard Coupe disc has a 59.1mm centre bore (not 58.1mm)

This is because the hub flange has a 0.5mm step to locate the disc, and then a 58.1 diameter for the wheel
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#1544466 - 13/07/2015 12:57 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
H_R Offline
Club member 1114
My life on the forum

Registered: 30/07/2012
Posts: 1632
Loc: Dark side of the Moon
Originally Posted By: Nigel
BTW - I also found out that the standard Coupe disc has a 59.1mm centre bore (not 58.1mm)

This is because the hub flange has a 0.5mm step to locate the disc, and then a 58.1 diameter for the wheel



Nigel if i remember correctly the new disc has a 59mm centre bore?

Does this mean they are a straight fit and there is no need for the shim??

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#1544469 - 13/07/2015 14:07 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: H_R]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
Originally Posted By: H_R
Nigel if i remember correctly the new disc has a 59mm centre bore?

Does this mean they are a straight fit and there is no need for the shim??


No - Punto Abarth discs are 4x100 and 60.1mm centre bore, so still need the shim

Abarth 500 discs are 4x100 and 59.1mm centre bore and fit without the shim

My earlier posts were incorrect - we all know that Coupe wheels are 58.1 centre bore, but I hadn't twigged that there's a step in the hub and the discs have a 1mm larger centre bore

I guess the simplest way to look at it is that Punto discs are 1mm too big (as well as the wrong PCD) and 500 discs are exactly right
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#1544470 - 13/07/2015 14:14 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
Jopa_zgd Offline
On a journey

Registered: 06/07/2013
Posts: 129
Loc: Zagreb, CRO
Originally Posted By: Nigel

So, I'm now looking for aftermarket brake rotors - I've found a place that will make them up from Brembo blanks - just got to give them the dimensions and negotiate a price

AP have some nice "J hook" rotors, 304x28mm. For about 250$. Just don't know will it fit to the center plate.

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#1544473 - 13/07/2015 14:52 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
andyps Offline
Club member 1482
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Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 1149
Loc: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
Nigel, does that mean that the discs off the 695 fit on the original Coupe hubs, or are you meaning the aftermarket ones? Great news if they fit the original hubs (except maybe for my bank account!).
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#1544474 - 13/07/2015 14:57 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
andyps Offline
Club member 1482
Enjoying the ride

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 1149
Loc: Pontefract, West Yorkshire
Just thinking about it - cost is probably pretty high, but would this kit be a bolt on upgrade - http://www.abarthcars.co.uk/Site/uk/ABARTH_BREMBO_BRAKING_SYSTEM_KIT

Could be a great way to get better brakes if so.
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#1544476 - 13/07/2015 15:06 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: andyps]
Nigel Offline
Club member 123
Forum veteran

Registered: 16/12/2005
Posts: 16982
Loc: Staffordshire
The issue with the hub flange diameters remains

The OE Coupe disc has a 151mm recess for the hub flange, the 500 Abarth disc has a 123.1mm recess - see the two technical drawings below

Standard Coupe disc

click to enlarge

500 Abarth floating disc

click to enlarge

I didn't measure the OE flange on my car, but I estimate it was about 128mm - just a little too big for the floating discs recess

So - if you have the smaller hub flange, the floating discs will fit, but if you have OE flanges, you'll need to have them replaced with aftermarket flanges (which involves replacing the wheel bearings as well)

PS - note on the technical drawings - the floating discs are 1.8KG per disc lighter than standard - given the money some of us spend on lighter wheels, this is a very significant saving of un-sprung weight
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#1544477 - 13/07/2015 15:17 Re: Floating discs at last [Re: Nigel]
H_R Offline
Club member 1114
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Registered: 30/07/2012
Posts: 1632
Loc: Dark side of the Moon
Ok so do you need different calipers to fit these?

As you can get a big brake kit including discs, callipers, pads, hoses and fitting kit (for a 500 of course) for £1000 which seems reasonable value and better value for money than £550 for just the discs

+ vat of course

^^^ that is the kit I was referring too in post above^^


Edited by H_R (13/07/2015 15:19)

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