My friend has a Lancia Delta intergralle Evo ll and we were discussing what gives it a quicker 0-60. Evo is 50 kg heavier, 10 bhp less, and one gear less. And yet it has a 0-60 of 5.7sec compared to 6.5sec for my 20vt. Top speed is lower which might suggest gearing, but my 20vt has 6 gears so I can't think the Evo would be that much shorter. The only real difference is 4wd, but that shouldn't make a difference on a dry road, just as in the early days of 4wd in rallying when they would loose out to the 2wd cars on tarmac. BTW, this is only a theoretical discussion, we have never tried to race each other, nor would we.
20VT, Aston DBS (1968) restomod
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Skiday]
#1659544 10/08/202215:5810/08/202215:58
Autocar tested the 20v turbo and got 0-60 mph in 6.0 seconds dead.
I think you have to give it about 3000 revs, then dump the clutch to get those figures. Don't try this at home unless you like the smell of clutch in the morning.
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Skiday]
#1659558 10/08/202222:4010/08/202222:40
Hmmm. I'm not suggesting that the 4wd isn't the advantage, but to my simple mind, if that's the thing, then how does any 2wd fwd ever beat 5.5sec, or does a 2wd have to be rwd to achieve that?
20VT, Aston DBS (1968) restomod
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Skiday]
#1659559 11/08/202200:0211/08/202200:02
Hmmm. I'm not suggesting that the 4wd isn't the advantage, but to my simple mind, if that's the thing, then how does any 2wd fwd ever beat 5.5sec, or does a 2wd have to be rwd to achieve that?
200bhp will break traction up until around 30mph. After that, all is equal. If you have 300bhp, it might be around 40mph, but after that, you can reduce the 40-60mph and duck under 6 seconds. All that extra power can only influence the increment that it can't break traction Think of it as a ceiling on maximum acceleration. I have max g listed on the attachments above.
I'll go over the spreadsheet tomorrow and show some examples. Weight distribution also helps a lot, as do more modern tyres. A Coupé with over 400bhp and track day tyres should be able to dip under 5 seconds.
F****** b****** thing...
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Skiday]
#1659571 11/08/202210:0311/08/202210:03
I've set up the spreadsheet so both sets are on what I call 'intermidiate' tyres. The sort of thing the Coupé came with when new so the standard car increments matches with road test data of the time. As you can see, performance from stand still is exactly the same. This is that ceiling I mentioned earlier and no amount of power will improve this. Once the standard car has fully hooked up (which is clearly somewhere between 30 and 40mph as the performance differ from here) the car with more power can then begin to pull away. For a bit of fun, I've added a data set for DLT's 20v Turbo when it made 622bhp. As you can see, the performance all the way up to 70mph is the same as mine. You can't put down any more power than 450bhp on cheap old tyres.
Clearly, better tyres will help with performance at lower speeds. Here's a data set for a standard car with track day rubber: 0-10mph 0.7 0-20mph 1.5 0-30mph 2.2 0-40mph 3.0 0-50mph 4.4 0-60mph 5.6 0-70mph 7.4 0-80mph 9.3 0-90mph 11.5 0-100mph 14.4 0-110mph 17.8 0-120mph 21.9 0-130mph 27.6 0-140mph 37.1 0-150mph 56.4
This shows why the Coupé can still be competitive with modern machinery. Road test data doesn't tell the whole picture as tyre technology has moved on so much since ours plodded up the test strip wearing P-Zeros in 1996. The numbers above would still be very good measured against new FWD cars today.
F****** b****** thing...
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Skiday]
#1659577 11/08/202213:5011/08/202213:50
Be interesting to factor in some sticky rubber AND a treated dragstrip. My 'seat of the pants' dyno reckoned my old Coupe was under 5 seconds 0-60 at Santa Pod - it was noticeably quicker off the line than on a normal road surface (at least up until the extra traction detonated the differential....)
Last edited by Nigel; 11/08/202213:50.
Re: How is Lancia Delta evo2 quicker?
[Re: Nigel]
#1659583 11/08/202215:1211/08/202215:12
Be interesting to factor in some sticky rubber AND a treated dragstrip. My 'seat of the pants' dyno reckoned my old Coupe was under 5 seconds 0-60 at Santa Pod - it was noticeably quicker off the line than on a normal road surface (at least up until the extra traction detonated the differential....)
Here's what I have for a standard Coupé on track day tyres, on a dragstrip (and therefore timed with a 1 foot rollout). I should think your Coupé would have been getting on for 4.5 seconds to 60mph.