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Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: Saint] #1306853
16/01/2012 15:17
16/01/2012 15:17

1
1NRO
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1NRO
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I was kinda hoping you would show the actual car and engine instalation and the takeoff on the exhaust manifold.
Method of installing the takeoff for the pressure reading on the exhaust can skew the readings.

Looking just at the numbers they are really good.

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1306858
16/01/2012 15:40
16/01/2012 15:40

G
group5lancia
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group5lancia
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And this is when I cranked the boost up:

Engine RPM 3500 4000 4500 5000 5500 6000 6500 7000 7500 8000 8500

Exh Pres, PSI 3.1 22.4 23.6 24.7 26.0 27.1 28.1 30.2 31.8 32.6 31.4

Boost, PSI 3.0 29.6 29.5 29.4 29.3 29.2 29.2 29.1 29.1 29.0 29.1

Cmprssr Pres Ratio 1.21 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09 3.09

Peak power is at 7500 rpm (round numbers)

Last edited by group5lancia; 16/01/2012 15:42.
Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1306871
16/01/2012 16:06
16/01/2012 16:06

G
group5lancia
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group5lancia
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G



And previous, smaller turbo:

Engine RPM 3500 4000 4500 5000 5500 6000 6500 7000 7500

Exh Pres, PSI 10.8 17.0 18.0 18.9 20.6 22.1 23.3 24.5 25.3

Boost, PSI 18.1 24.4 24.4 24.3 24.2 24.1 24.1 24.1 24.0

Cmprssr Pres Ratio 2.24 2.68 2.68 2.68 2.68 2.68 2.68 2.68 2.68

Boost was better a 3500 RPM but max power was a 6500, because the compressor was going 'off map' and becoming very inefficient (and maybe because exhaust back pressure was rising too?). With the bigger turbo I lost 500RPM at the bottom end but gained 1000 RPM at the top end - plus I can run 2 bar boost which the other turbo couldn't manage.

Last edited by group5lancia; 16/01/2012 16:09.
Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: Saint] #1306887
16/01/2012 16:36
16/01/2012 16:36

1
1NRO
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1NRO
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Looks and sounds great, shame you won't show the car off.

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: Saint] #1306889
16/01/2012 16:37
16/01/2012 16:37

1
1NRO
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1NRO
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You say an 8v too, I thought you were a 16v man

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1306897
16/01/2012 17:17
16/01/2012 17:17

G
group5lancia
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group5lancia
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G



Originally Posted By: 1NRO
You say an 8v too, I thought you were a 16v man


16 valve is the new engine. Progress halted due to the general economic climate!

If it wasn't such a faff getting pictures on here I would put a couple up. You will find some here - though not engine specific:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/34761498@N04/page2/

If you look in the bottom left corner of picture I~000004 you will see a chalk mark on the manifold just before the turbo flange. That is where the pressure sensor now fits. The EGT sensor is fitted 180 degrees opposite this.

Last edited by group5lancia; 16/01/2012 17:30.
Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1306951
16/01/2012 19:50
16/01/2012 19:50

1
1NRO
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1NRO
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1



Originally Posted By: group5lancia


16 valve is the new engine. Progress halted due to the general economic climate!


^That I can relate to, mines the all time slowest project!

Well I'm impressed, that's a cool car with some nice parts on it.

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: Saint] #1306959
16/01/2012 20:05
16/01/2012 20:05
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 742
Midlands
Easy Offline
Enjoying the ride
Easy  Offline
Enjoying the ride

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 742
Midlands
That's a very cool car.

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: Easy] #1306987
16/01/2012 21:22
16/01/2012 21:22

G
group5lancia
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group5lancia
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G



Thanks thumb

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1308107
19/01/2012 15:33
19/01/2012 15:33

T
tricky
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tricky
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Martin just to confirm,

Your exhaust manifold has some distance between the colector and the turbo and the EMAP point was taken off just before the turbine inlet flange, yes ?

What turbo was fitted during the test readings taken above and were you using a normal 3bar MAP for datalogging it ? Did you need to restrict or dampen the signal line to get such stable readings ?

Ta.

Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1308153
19/01/2012 18:00
19/01/2012 18:00

G
group5lancia
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group5lancia
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G



The "small" turbo was a T35 and the "large" turbo is a T38 - both from Turbo Technics.

The manifold is a 4-2-1 and the '1' part is quite a bit longer than just a typical collector length. The manifold/turbine seem to do a fairly good job of dampening out pressure spikes on their own. The sensor take-off is on this pipe about 25mm before the turbo flange.

The sensor was datalogged at 100Hz. On a 4 cylinder engine at 3000 rpm there are exactly 100 exhaust pulses per second and at At 8500 rpm there are 283 per second.

The pressure signal to the sensor is 'damped' by having a small orifice followed by a relatively large volume in the pipework between the manifold and the logging shows a stable output - much the same way as a MAP sensor on a plenum gives a very stable output when logged at the same rate.

Last edited by group5lancia; 19/01/2012 18:12.
Re: Intercooler design and flow test [Re: ] #1308181
19/01/2012 18:59
19/01/2012 18:59

T
tricky
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tricky
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T



Looks like a nice manifold, I always wondered how a 421 might work on a single scroll motor.

Thanks anyway you confirmed an idea I had.

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