<SNIP>



If you're going to cut and paste you should at least make sure that the information you're cutting and pasting matches the commentary that you're going to add



Unless all of the reports describe the same thing it's not logical to assume they all have the same cause, is it?

Yes it would appear that way however lets have a little history lesson first. The most advanced aircraft we have today is the SR71 black bird made in the 60s which can out perfrom all of the current fighter jets here it is here with estimate speeds above mach 3.5 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird

After that development changes were made for its natural replacment the SR75 under the Aurora project here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurora_(aircraft) note the engine changes for the sr 75 uses a pulse jet wave engine increasing speeds to 5-7 mach evidence of the engine produce a signature contrail.

Note that the above 2 craft are not neccesarly back engineered but the next one is

The T3rb uses anti gravity technolgy reversed engineered however no where near the level as it only elimantes gravity by roughly 89% and therfore still requires thrust http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NClj4XxkUMg&feature=related

No offence, Jonny, but it's very tiring arguing with you - you just seem to have so many rabbits to keep pulling out of your ... hat.

So, briefly:

1. There's no proper evidence that the Aurora exists.

2. There's even less evidence for the T3rb.

3. Even if it did exist it would be at the bottom of a multi-billion dollar black hole, so how would you know any technology it has wasn't developed using that money?

4. You'd help your case if you knew anything at all about physics, "it only elimantes gravity by roughly 89% and therfore still requires thrust" ... really?

5. Where do you get your information, accurate to 1%, about how much gravity it 'eliminates' on an aircraft that is, with the best will in the world, made up?

Ok I believe I have now given plenty evidence from astronauts confirming ufo alien contact.

3 miltary personal confirming alien contact although I could give 30 more. But whats the point if my evidence is not being evaluated properly.

It is hard to exepct the facts but the truth is their if you chose to not believe it then dont its that simple.

You can label all theese great men from the astronauts to high ranking miltary personal I have qouted as well as me 'nutters'

I can accept that not all UFO's are alien spacecraft probably only 5% with 10% being our own the rest other phenomenon.

I will leave you with another brave man A U.S politician has admitted that UFO visitation is real and aliens have made contact with America’s leaders. The politician, Henry McElroy, a lifetime member of the Republican Party, has released a video statement (see video clip below) regarding what he knows about aliens and UFOs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNV8-k5UvpY

So there we have it folks you can still choose not to believe.

I will not be responding unless my evidence given from the links provided is fairly evaluated in particular the key whitness testimony backing my claims up.

And as for lazar who proved him to be a fraud? The man dubbed a crackpot by us goverment now sells unique radioactive ores and suchlike to them dont believe me www.unitednuclear.com

Also, i'd just like to point out that the SR-71 was retired, not becuase they had created a replacement top secret aircraft, but because of the use of surveillance satellites.

There would be absoloutly no need to develop a fast moving stealth reconnaissance aircraft anymore. Why backward engineer super advanced alien technology into a redundant platform?

You don't need to 'believe' in facts.

The problem is that we ARE fairly evaluating your evidence. You just aren't answering our counter questions!

1. The same could have been said for the SR71 or stealth bomber there real.

2. The T3rb has had whistlebower info regarding it similar to the sr75

3. Tyr trillion dollar black hole Andrew get with the times http://www.corbettreport.com/pentagon-frets-over-wasted-billions-ignores-missing-trillions/

4. ok Andrew if the gravity was reduced by 89% there would still be a deficit of 11% what would hold that i the air I think its your physics needing looked at not mine.

If you don't mind I'm just going to take a break and eat some popcorn while Barnacle applies some percusive education to you.

What you will find if you actaully bothered to reasearch the SR71 also had a fighter version. As for the satelites russia for example can tell when a US satelite is able to take photos.

With that in mind survelliance planes are still on the go as try spotting somthing flying at mach 7.

My last post on this thread as I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall.

I could post a hundred videos on YouTube of people who think they've seen the Loch Ness monster. I could post another hundred videos of dinosaur shaped objects and shadows in murky water. I'm sure if I dug around I could find files where the government has, at some time, investigated the Loch Ness monster. *NONE* of this would be evidence of its existence. It wouldn't prove a thing.

I can categorically say nothing you have linked to is evidence of the existence of alien piloted craft visiting Earth. It simply isn't. If you choose to believe it is that's your prerogative, much the same as someone choosing to believe in (a) God, but when looked at objectively and scientifically neither make any sense whatsoever. Believing in alien piloted UFOs is as sane as believing in tooth fairies, ghosts, genies, dragons, leprechauns, Thundercats, Welformed's driving kills.....

I think we all believe in them.

Could you reference that please Jonny? I've never heard of it, so even if there was a variant, it obviouly didn't become operational. According to Wiki (which I appreciate should not be treated as the authority on the subject) there is no mention of a fighter variant:

The SR-71A was the main production variant.
The SR-71B was a trainer variant.
The SR-71C was a hybrid aircraft composed of the rear fuselage of the first YF-12A (S/N 60-6934) and the forward fuselage from a SR-71 static test unit.

Production of the SR-71 totaled 32 aircraft with 29 SR-71As, 2 SR-71Bs, and the single SR-71C.[79]

Ok we are never going to agree but choose to ignore evidence given by high ranking miltary personal,astronauts, and polticians.

Try getting that calibre of testimony to prove the loch ness monster,dinsours,fairies or goblins go on proof me wrong there and back up your claim!!!!!!

You clearly have no constructive case either for or against the thread so do your self a favour and simply dont post on it again fair enough?

It's either developed, or reverse engineered. It can't be both.



That would be a neat trick if they could do it. Mercury freezes at 234K. It doesn't go superconductive though until 4C or thereabouts, and it has a very low magnetic tolerance.



Once again, nice trick if you could do it. I'm sure I must have missed the Nobel prize that someone got for this one.

As an aside, if the US government is so keen to keep this a secret, how come it's up there on the web? And as the author of the piece has such detailed knowledge, why has he not built his own? The benefits to the road transport industry alone would guarantee his retirement in immediate luxury.

Jonny, the question was how do you arrive at a figure of 89% reduction in the effects of gravity? From that video link you posted higher up all I saw was a series of strange concepts, mostly, powered by ducted fan technology.

The problem I see is that each vehicle looks to have sufficient size of fan to provide adequate thrust to move the vehicle. Why would that be if you could reduce gravity by 89%?

Could you aid in my research pleas? I cant find anything on an SR-71 figher, apart from 'black ops' discussions in which most people are agreeing that such an aircraft could not exist as flying at mach 3+ speeds relies on flying in thin atmosphere.

Weaponising an SR-71 into a fighter would be pointless as it could never achieve the the same speeds:

"hypersonic aircraft fly at extreme altitude because the air is thinner, hence you get a more favorable ratio of airspeed vs groundspeed. SR-71 couldn't fly anywhere near its max groundspeed at low altitudes."

Also we'll ignore the fact that the ONLY anti-air defence the SR-71 had was to accelerate and out-run a missile. Pretty useless in combat for starters, and also it would be pretty stupid to build a plan which would either just fly into own missile, or the missile would hit the other plane, AFTER you've flown past it!

Mach 7 - call it 5,250 miles per hour - requires approximately five hours to circumnavigate the earth. A satellite in low earth orbit takes approximately an hour and a half, and is a hundred miles further away.

To be fair, orbital mechanics mean that if no course corrections are made it's easy to know when it's overhead, but (a) spy satellites are reputed to carry large stocks of manoeuvring fuel which allows them to change their orbital path significantly and (b) it's a lot easier to stealth something which is so much further away and not acting as a major heat source when it's not manoeuvring...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_YF-12 Not all were dubbed under the SR codeword

The full physics of t3rb for barnacle. The triangular shaped nuclear powered TR-3B aerospace platform was developed under the Top Secret, Aurora Program with SDI and black budget monies. At least 3 of the billion dollar plus TR-3Bs were flying by 1994.

The Aurora is the most classified aerospace development program in existence. The TR-3B is the most exotic vehicle created by the Aurora Program. It is funded and operationally tasked by the National Reconnaissance Office, the NSA, and the CIA. The TR-3B flying triangle is not fiction and was built with technology available in the mid 80s and uses more reversed alien technology than any vehicle ever before.

Not every UFO spotted is one of theirs

The TR-3B vehicle’s outer coating is electro-chemical reactive and changes with electrical RF Radar stimulation and can change reflectiveness, radar absorptiveness, and color. This is also the first US vehicle to use quasi-crystals in the vehicle’s skin.

This polymer skin, when used in conjunction with the TR-3Bs Electronic Counter Measures and, ECCM, can make the vehicle look like a small aircraft, or a flying cylinder – or even trick radar receivers into falsely detecting a variety of aircraft, no aircraft, or several aircraft at various locations. Some unclassified research under the heading of ?electro-chromatic? can be found on these stealth coatings.

A circular, plasma filled accelerator ring called the Magnetic Field Disrupter, surrounds the rotable crew compartment and is far ahead of any imaginable technology.

Sandia and Livermore laboratories developed the reverse engineered MFD technology. The government will go to any lengths to protect this technology. The plasma, mercury based, is pressurized at 250,000 atmospheres at a temperature of 150 degrees Kelvin, and accelerated to 50,000 rpm to create a super-conductive plasma with the resulting gravity disruption.

The MFD generates a magnetic vortex field, which disrupts or neutralizes the effects of gravity on mass within proximity, by 89 percent. Do not misunderstand. This is NOT antigravity. Anti-gravity provides a repulsive force that can be used for propulsion.

The MFD creates a disruption of the Earth’s gravitational field upon the mass within the circular accelerator.

The mass of the circular accelerator and all mass within the accelerator, such as the crew capsule, avionics, MFD systems, fuels, crew environmental systems, and the nuclear reactor, are reduced by 89%.

A side note to the Magnetic Field Disruptor development; one source who worked at GD Convair Division in the mid 60s described a mercury based plasma that was cooled to super-conductive temperatures rotated at 45 thousand revolutions per minute and pressurized at thousands of atmospheres.

This would be considered state-of-the-art technology even by today’s standards, some 30 years after he worked this project. He related that the project achieved its objective. Instruments and test objects within the center of the accelerator showed a 50 percent loss of weight, attributed to a reduction in the gravitational field. He had worked on MFD as far back as 1965 and was told by a senior scientist that the research had been going on for a decade. See: Convair, notes from Gravitics research and Gravity Rand article.

The current MFD in the TR-3B causes the effect of making the vehicle extremely light, and able to outperform and outmaneuver any craft yet constructed – except, of course, those UFOs we did not build.

The TR-3B is a high altitude, stealth, reconnaissance platform with an indefinite loiter time. Once you get it up there at speed, it doesn’t take much propulsion to maintain altitude.

At Groom Lake their have been whispered rumors of a new element that acts as a catalyst to the plasma.

Recently NASA and the Russians have admitted breakthroughs in technology that would use a plasma shield for exotic aerospace vehicles. If you know anything about the history of classified black programs, you know that by the time NASA starts researching something, it’s either proven or old technology. They are the poor step children when it comes to research and development technology and funding.

With the vehicle mass reduced by 89% the craft can travel at Mach 9, vertically or horizontally. sources say the performance is limited only the stresses that the human pilots can endure. Which is a lot, really, considering along with the 89% reduction in mass, the G forces are also reduced by 89%.

The crew of the TR-3B should be able to comfortable take up to 40Gs. The same flight characteristics described in the Belgium sightings and many other sightings. Reduced by 89%, the occupants would feel about 4.2 Gs.

The TR-3Bs propulsion is provided by 3 multimode thrusters mounted at each bottom corner of the triangular platform. The TR-3 is a sub-Mach 9 vehicle until it reaches altitudes above l20,000 feet – then who knows how fast it can go!

The 3 multimode rocket engines mounted under each corner of the craft use hydrogen or methane and oxygen as a propellant.

In a liquid oxygen/hydrogen rocket system, 85% of the propellant mass is oxygen. The nuclear thermal rocket engine uses a hydrogen propellant, augmented with oxygen for additional thrust.

The reactor heats the liquid hydrogen and injects liquid oxygen in the supersonic nozzle, so that the hydrogen burns concurrently in the liquid oxygen afterburner.


The multimode propulsion system can operate in the atmosphere, with thrust provided by the nuclear reactor, in the upper atmosphere, with hydrogen propulsion, and in orbit, with the combined hydrogen oxygen propulsion.

What you have to remember is that the 3 multi-mode rocket engines only have to propel 11 percent of the mass of the Top Secret TR-3B. The engines are reportedly built by Rockwell.

Erm... The YF-12 was a generation of technology BEFORE the SR-71 ?!

First flight YF-12 : 1963
First flight SR-71 : 1964

You do realise, don't you, that what you posted was somewhere on par with a "Science of Star Trek" book?

It has lots of words that sound scientific and no sense to it what-so-ever.

No, wait, let me guess, somebody with a degree in physics has said that it's all possible.

Just picking on one point - your whole post is very similar to the page I quoted.



g-force as experienced by a pilot or passenger has nothing whatsoever to do with gravity - it's the rate of change of velocity, either linear and/or radially. 40G course changes would still leave a passenger smeared on the cockpit walls... as an example, most people become unconscious, without support, at four or five g. Eight or nine is about as much as a trained pilot can manage even with computer aided pressure suits, active compression, and high-oxygen feeds. Falling from a hundred feet and stopping in six inches or so broke my back in three places along with a number of ribs and sundry internal injuries - probably less than 10g.

You're presenting statements as 'facts' with no supporting evidence. At best they are speculation; at worst they are speculative fiction.

They are both similar design with one directly for survalance the other has a missle payload


(YF12A)
lets look at the stats
Specifications (YF-12A)Data from Lockheed's SR-71 'Blackbird' Family[20]

General characteristics

Crew: 2
Length: 101 ft 8 in (30.97 m)
Wingspan: 55 ft 7 in (16.95 m)
Height: 18 ft 6 in (5.64 m)
Wing area: 1,795 ft² (167 m²)
Empty weight: 60,730 lb (27,604 kg)
Loaded weight: 124,000 lb (56,200 kg[5])
Max. takeoff weight: 140,000 lb (63,504 kg)
Powerplant: 2 × Pratt & Whitney J58/JTD11D-20A high-bypass-ratio turbojet with afterburner (turbo/ramjet hybrid)
Dry thrust: 20,500 lbf (91.2 kN) each
Thrust with afterburner: 31,500 lbf (140 kN) each
Performance

Maximum speed: Mach 3.35 (2,275 mph, 3,661 km/h[5]) at 80,000 ft (24,400 m)
Range: 3,000 mi (4,800 km)
Service ceiling: 90,000 ft (27,400 m)
Armament


Missiles: 3× Hughes AIM-47A air-to-air missiles located internally in fuselage bays
Avionics


Hughes AN/ASG-18 look-down/shoot-down fire control radar

SR71


Strategic Reconnaissance
Contractor: Lockheed-Martin Skunkworks
Crew: Two
Unit Cost: N/A
Powerplant
Two Pratt and Whitney J-58 axial-flow turbojets with afterburners, each producing 32,500 pounds of thrust
Dimensions
Length: 107.4 feet (32.73 m)
Wingspan: 55.6 feet (16.94 m)
Height: 18.5 feet (5.63 m)
Weights
Empty: N/A
Maximum Takeoff: 140,000 pounds (52,250 kg) -- gross
Performance
Speed: over Mach 3.2 / 2,000 mph (3,200 kph)
Ceiling: over 85,000 feet (26,000 m)
Range: over 2000 miles (3200 km) unrefueled


So basically the same plane designed by the same company flights launches 1 year appart one for surveliance the other fighter jet.

Thank you truffle keep on topic please instead of me handing it to you!

The MFD generates a magnetic vortex field, which disrupts or neutralizes the effects of gravity on mass within proximity, by 89 percent. Do not misunderstand. This is NOT antigravity. Anti-gravity provides a repulsive force that can be used for propulsion.

The MFD creates a disruption of the Earth’s gravitational field upon the mass within the circular accelerator.

The mass of the circular accelerator and all mass within the accelerator, such as the crew capsule, avionics, MFD systems, fuels, crew environmental systems, and the nuclear reactor, are reduced by 89%.

Therefore the mass is reduced by 89%
so i believe the physics holds grounds?

Jonny, as you've repeatedly demonstrated your understanding of physics is at a sub-GCSE standard, so I very much doubt anybody cares what you believe, and repeatedly pasting snippets from the same source isn't going to convince anybody it's real science.

So in conclusion, there was no fighter version of the SR71. Nor was there an operational fighter based on the YF 21. Thanks for the clarification.

Well i can see why it never went into service!

Also, i'm not sure why you're using this as evidence of, well, anything.

It never went into service, and it was quickly found to be a hugely flawed idea.

It also doesnt answer my points that the SR-71 was retired becuase of the use of satelites and that the platform was redundant.

I'm guesing that you are using it as an example that perhaps this tr3b is an experimental fighter aircraft. Except your own article states:

"The TR-3B is a high altitude, stealth, reconnaissance platform with an indefinite loiter time. Once you get it up there at speed, it doesn’t take much propulsion to maintain altitude."

Again contradicting your own point. Even if this was a real aircraft, and exists in a hanger somewhere (and thats an extreme IF) it would never be used! Look at the furore cuased by the downing of a spy drone. The US military simply wouldnt put an asset like that into use simply through fear that it would malfunction/crash/get shot down etc etc.

Blimey, if the aliens who have been doing this for millenia are still able to crash, do you trust a couple of US pilots?

You need to take a photo of a North Korean Nuclear program, You have the choice of a multi-trillion pound one-of-a-kind aircraft, using secret alien technology, you need to get it up, fly across the planet, back and land it without anyone knowing.

Or you could just re-task a satelite into the area.

Is this the SR71 which flew at 1.6 miles per second on a mission generated by President Reagan against Colonel Qaddafi in April 1986? From what I understand this equates to 2,125 mph.....

X-37b

no wait ignore that as it is real.


edit: ufos are real. some are covered up. None origonate beyond our atmosphear. Secret planes are interesting and finaly the language of physics is maths not wittering!