What sort of performance are any of you guys achieveing with standard and tuned 20VT's? The original Autocar test reckoned 0-60 in 6.0 and 0-100 in 14 secs. However, I can't say I've been in a std 20VT (including my own) that feels anywhere near this quick. I guess the tuned boys will be closer or better than this, but by how much? Share your experiences here.

Standard varies on the tyres, launch, surface, but You can tease a 6-second dash to 60 usually, and I don't know about the 0-100 but I was doing the quarter in about 15 seconds normally, unless it was an exceptionally fast run and it dipped into the high 14's.
Tuned? Well take your pic. My best was 5.72 secs to 60 and a 14 sec dead 1/4 with breathing mods and a G-Tech 1. We've had sub 12-sec 1/4's before now (flea and Mavric)
If you want a pretty accurate measurement of your car's performance, buy a G-Tech performance Pro meter cheap off ebay and find a nice quiet road. They are accurate to within 1% providing the road is flat. You'll notice how easy it is to fluff the launch causing a 7 second-plus launch and crappy quarter. It really is all about the launch if you want to get any decent results and in the rain? laughable!

Interesting thread!

I'm actually doing 80-200 km/h (50-125 MPH?) in 16 seconds. I made 19.5 or 20 seconds when my car was full stock.

I have a 20VT with decat + free flow catback and my own eprom (250 HP?)

I'm going forged/balanced soon + FMIC + light Headwork + 3" DP + GT3071R-WG + 440cc + lots of other parts and i hope for 10 seconds.

9.9 seconds will be my dream

0-60 is so so difficult to get right in the coupe...
I'm guessing i'm between 5 - 5.5 secs to 60!!
60 - 100 is a much better measurement for coupe performance... Filmed mine recently then timed it ( allowing for my peedo to be approx 10% out i timed from 66 - 110.... which i did in 5.8 secs!!

Which surprised me, currently running 306 bhp tho!

Nick

I'm doing 0-90 in 8, 0-100 in just under 10, 0-115 in just over 12, 0-150 in around 25

Autocar got a 0100mph of 14.5s in the original 1996 doad test of the 20vT but then recorded only a 15s in the 0-100-0mph article a few years later. Just a little detail but still important.

Flea did a redline day a few years back, the results of which I've uploaded here

He estimates that the car was making 390bhp at the time.

what would you say a 260bhp coop would make trappy and a 300bhp coop?
i remeber you doing a chart a little while ago but i can't find it

0-60 times really vary. It all about the launch, tyres, tyre pressure and weight your carring. You could acheive anything from 5.5 to 6.2 secounds.

Here are the numbers it brings back peanuthead



It is very important to remember the difference in performance that even a few minor mods can make. The boost limit overide will HUGELY improve 2nd gear performance as it removes the boost limit, giving up to 60ft/lbs of extra torque in the lower gears. I reckon it would give knock 3 tenths off the standard cars 0-60mph.

so a 300bhp coop is about the same as a e36m3 evo if it hits its actully 321 power output?
i guess more likely a m3 e46 rival then?
getting 0-60 yimes like that would be really good.
60-120 mph i bet the coop is in its eliment?

The BMW has it's power within a really narrow band of revs. Not so the 20VT!

There is NOT a boost limit in 1st and 2nd gear in a 20vt.

No it does not - it just has a normal linear powerband rather than a turbo.

As you start going over 300bhp in a coupe the powerband is going to suffer - a bigger turbo will not spool at 2,500 like the standard car. Below 4,000 rpm an E46 M3 would have a significant advantage.

But there is on the 16vt???
Probably a good thing to be honest as if (when) the wheels start spinning in 2nd i'll prob only see at most 1 bar untill i'mm into 3rd!!
Is that chart for just 20vt coops as my 60-100 is alot quicker than 6.7 sec!! (i'm running 306 bhp)

Nick

Sure, but there is a boost RISE limiter in all gears but it only works in 1st and 2nd as these are the only gears that a standard car can trigger it in. It effectivley limits torque available in these gears.

so, if looking at a boost gauge, what difference can you see in 1st and 2nd gear between a standard and chipped coupe?
will a chipped coupe boost higher in 1st and 2nd?
in my coupe, 2nd gear boosts to 17psi quite easily and really pulls,1st gear seems to be a bit less unless i realy put my foot down.

Yes

2100rpm 77hp /246nm
3300rpm 177hp/360nm ( seems high to me )
4000rpm 205hp/350nm

those are from e46 M3

my 0-60 is around 4 sec, hope to get it a little better when i get it finetune.

Nope - the ecu cuts the boost on the standard chip if the revs rise too quickly, i.e wheelspin. No wheelspin then no boost cut.

i have a big turbo on my car and i love comparing e46 m3's with my car and to be honest i destroy them from start to finish and yes i mean from stand still and from rolling,just becoming a pointless comparison,wouldnt mind one as a every day driver though

in a Coupe? That's a bit optimistic

Its not a coupe anymore, its 4x4

Do you have any 0-60 figures for yours Nigel?
Last year I recorded 5.1 to 62mph, and now its much better with launch control and traction control, so I am guessing my 0-60 would be around 4.9 now Will do some measurements soon...

I don't have any 0-60 figures for mine, but I guess it would be fairly close to five seconds

Kenneth - apologies - didn't realise you were 4WD - in that case, 4 seconds is quite possible with a brutal launch

I dont care what turbo or spec of coupe you are in - you will not beat one off the line unless you get a PERFECT launch, and the M3 utterly fluffs it - or can't be ar*ed.

When rolling you will also not 'destroy' one in a straight line until you have a 400bhp+ coupe.

i duno if im just a s**t drive but i recon my 0-60 time is worse than standered i rele wanna go in someone elses coupe similar to mine to compare. i just get pure wheel spin in 1st no matter how much i ballence the clutch n fether the throttle. although my iphone time me a 5.2 sec 0-60 time but fccuk know how accurate that is.

It wont be accurate. I really can't see why anyone is bothered about the 0-60 time of a performance car - it really depends on the drivetrain and weight of the car and the launch. The claimed figures can't be replicated without a fair bit of luck - and even then it a very poor reflection on how quick a car is in the real world.

The statistic is for meaningless pub arguements:

'my car does 0-60 0.2 of a second faster than yours according to the figures in the back of evo, and they gave it a good writeup, which is the only reason I bought one.....'

Stick drag tyres on a 20vt (not AWD converted one) with 400bhp+ and you'll get a 5 second 0-60 or a bit less. Add another 200bhp and I doubt it will change much.

ok then suba i cant destroy m3's with my coupe from standing or from rolling i must be lying

BMW M3 2002 :
343hp/365nm

0-100kmh 5,2 sec
0-160kmh 11,6 sec
0-200kmh 18,6 sec

so 100-200kmh is 13,4 sec .
well I have to say, that is easy to beat at least..

there was another result too, there was
0-100 4,8 sec
0-160 10,9 sec
0-200 16,8 sec

so 100-200kmh is 12.0 sec

still thats easy to beat ..

one more result was found:

seems that 100 - 200kmh with E46 M3 is around
12.0 -13.4 sec

Would be also quite handy if we could post 1/8 mile and 1/4 mile times

i thought a m46 m3 0-62 was 4.7 seconds and 0-100 mpg 11.7 which makes it bloody quick.
i borrowed my uncles e46 m3 csl for a month and its was quite a bit quicker than my skyline at the time which was running 320bhp and that again was quite a bit quicker than my stage one coop.
i would surgest you would need about 300 bhp to keep with one rolling and 360bhp to try a keep up with one off the line.
then the handle and brakes to compare with so really a well set up 360bhp coop driven well to keep up from standing or around a track.

but thats not the point of this and lets face it a decent e46 m3 will set you back 15k compared to a coop. lukes car for example would really bother a e46 and his can be bought for 4.5k!

if i was to buy something for that money i would get something like johns's car for 10k and save 5 for running the car for a year lol.

I doubt you would see any real difference in a 0-60 time between a 300bhp coupe and a 360 bhp coupe on road tyres. The issue is the FWD traction not the power.

I've owned a very well setup 20VT running over 340 bhp, and driven an E46 M3 several times now. When rolling the 20vt was noticeably faster (and feels it from the turbo kick) - but it would not destroy the M3 by any means. It would also keep up in the corners on a track - with the driver pushing hard, and getting the most from the car, but would not be much faster overall with the M3 making up time on the brakes and getting the power down earlier.

On bumpy lanes the M3 would romp away with the 20vt bouncing everywhere on the coilovers.

A very good e46 M3 will set you back 12K now, not 15.

I prefered my 20vt overall though - but as I said you would need to be running 400bhp+ to really pull away from the BMW, and the extra power will not help you in the corners - if anything the extra lag from a big turbo will do quite the opposite.

the reason i maybe think it would run away from the coop in the coners as it was a csl m3!
a standard m3 maybe not then.

well i have been looking but reall a low milage e46 whichis say 7 years old is still about 15k.
i would rather buy a 15k m3 and know it won't break than risk a 12k m3 and worry about stupid bmw labour rates lol.

A good friend of mine just bought an immaculate one for 12K - 02 plate. There are specialists for them.....

M3 csl by all accounts is a different animal - having not driven one I can't comment first hand though.

ok fair enough prices must have dropped. i would like one.
i love the csl but don't think its worth the extra money over a standard m3.

those figures are taken from magazine tests
so they are correct, not what manufacture claims

possibly a slightly nieve comment....

hello i forgot to mention i am running just under 400bhp

i have been looking at 1/4 mile times on an m3 e46 and have noticed that they are only getting mid 13 seconds and i did manage a 13.2 @ 0.9bar of boost unmapped and my car is now mapped to 1.5bar all the way to the redline on a gt3071r,car is very capable of mid 12's now mapped

if you are running close to 400bhp, then you WILL seriously embarrass a stock E46 M3, especially once rolling. With the correct technique, you'll also beat it on a standing start (although the M3 driver will have far less chance of fluffing it)

Surely you should be considering an entry to this year's Ten of the Best?

Only a small detail....

well i am just getting my other engine rebuilt at the moment nigel and hopefully it should be done in time for

totb,so should be joining you and leighton there,also i forgot to mention my car is stripped and has only one

purpose,nigel i remember you saying in a thread on tyres that you use toyo t1r's and dont get no spin in

2nd,well i upgraded to these cos i had no traction when running my gt28rs and they solved that problem,well

once leighton mapped my car with the gt30 on it,my car wheel spins coming on to boost in 2nd now but will still

say that tyres are so important.

It's good to hear you want to be in TOTB as well Are you doing anything with it being stripped out i.e. rollcage

i dont really want a roll cage as it is more weight,but im not really interested in the track though

i beg to differ in the nicest possible way with suba not westcoupe. my freind works for sitner bmw he has brought home many e46 m3s and iv had a few comparisons in my 249.6 bhp coupe
hard top im v slightly faster on the move 40mph+ soft top i pull slightly more on it close though so a 400 break coupe will totaly TROUNCE a std e46 m3 on the move it would be a total walk over more power less weight.
I don't care if anyone doubts this if they do they are wrong.
my coupe ran 1/4 mile in 13.9 a e46 will do that im sure but will lauch better

wow seems 0-60-100 mph launch is of great intrest. Its getting a more 20VT v/s M3 thread.

250 bhp 0 - 103mph 13.92 at pod though, good surface
so im sure std coupe will do 14.6
NEW focus rs in new autocar mag 0-100 13.9 apparently

0-anything means nothing in real world performance, just top trumps figures...

agreed there 60-100 means alot more in real world unless on a drag strip

Mine does 0-60 in 3.7 seconds and makes E46 M3's look ridiculous. Standard trim only an air filter and a remap.
Top speed around 200mph.

Ok ok it's not a coop!
http://www.lanciahf.eu/TEMP/Corvette/ma_Z.jpg

I'm not too keen on this either anymore. You're much better off taking each 10mph increment and working out the distance travelled over that time by using simple acceleration/distance formulas. I'll give you accurate distance travelled for any increment, for just about any car you could want numbers for. If I can't, I'll find them

I noticed the 5.7 0-60mph and 13.9 0-100mph for the new Focus RS today in this weeks Autocar also. 300bhp and 1467kgs is not too hot though the handling will surely be something else. A 280bhp coop you have the measure of one in a straight line IMO.

I am, but only because it works in the Coupe's favour.

You can do 60-100 in the coupe on boost all the time without changing gear, but some cars may require a gear change or be well out of their peak power band at the start of it.

Just checked my Gtech RR results from last year, 0-60 MPH in 5.067 secs.

30-70 or 30-100mph is a good indicator, cos it takes out the whole 1st gear wheel spinning issue. Also 30-70 is usually v. close to the 0-60 figure and easy to replicate on a decent dual carriagewa. Autocar recorded an impressive 5.4 sec 30-70 figure IIRC.

I agree... 30-70 would be a great measure of a coops performance!! Might try it today, as it is LEGAL

Nick

Thing is, you really NEED a Vbox Performance Box to ensure that your speed is accurate. Of course this means that you'll also have increment data recorded every tenth of a second.

Forum, purchqse one and then hire a decent run way. We can get good numbers for all cars, and I can then run ALL of the number through the calculator for 0-400m and 0-1000m times and terminals.

The best measure of a cars performance, is to find out who is in front after x seconds or metres, from x speed.

I can do this if I have good numbers.

[quote=Trappy]Here are the numbers it brings back peanuthead

coupe
260bhp 300bhp
0-30mph: 2.4 2.4
0-40mph: 3.3 3.2
0-50mph: 4.6 4.4
0-60mph: 5.6 5.4
0-70mph: 7.3 6.8
0-80mph: 9.2 8.6
0-90mph: 10.9 10.2
0-100mph: 13.2 12.1
0-110mph: 16.3 14.8
0-120mph: 19.5 17.5
0-130mph: 25.0 22.1

so a 260 couupe is faster than the new so called hyper hatch focus rs in a straight line any way.
Evo magazine resutls using timing gear
0-60 5.9
0-100 14.2
0.130 27.0
quater mile 14.5 @ 101.2 mph

I've just changed dump valve and had thermostat changed cos it wasn't reaching temp correctly.
Strapped my Vbox Mini onto the windscreen and achieved the following

0.00 0 0.00 0.00
10.00 00:00.96 0.00 2.07
20.00 00:01.82 0.00 7.78
30.00 00:02.62 0.01 16.70
40.00 00:03.72 0.02 33.96
50.00 00:05.18 0.04 62.95
60.00 00:06.64 0.06 98.85
70.00 00:08.83 0.10 162.99
80.00 00:11.00 0.15 235.80
90.00 00:13.71 0.21 339.83
95.47 00:15.22 0.25 402.00
100.00 00:16.67 0.29 465.83

So in summary, 0-60 in 6.64 with not too much wheelspin, 30-70 in 6.21sec, and 0-100 in 16.67. 1/4 mile in 15.22 at 95.47mph on concrete road surface. 60-100 in 10.03 sec.

Car is stock 20VT 95,000 miles- running Pirelli P6000 tyres and a Bailey DV26 dump Valve.
Boost gauge to be fitted - possibly an EBV clean and then a RR session to see if power can be improved. The rev limiter cuts in at 68mph in 2nd gear which means a gear change interrupts the 30-70 time. The Autocar test car achieved 72mph in 2nd, hence the better 5.4 sec 30-70 time.

Overall pleased, but could do better. Wouldn't mind trying some 'sticky' front tyres, GTEC1 and toying with the PRV, but don't like the thought of ECU not being able to cut boost in an emergency.

yeah get gtec 1 and maybe a blueflame
mine came down into 13s to 100 with just gtec and filter
amazing performance upgrade for such a puny amount of money the gtec.

Yes but original 220bhp Coupe (when new achieved 0-60 in 6.0s, 0-100 in 14.5s , qtr mile in 14.5 sec. Can't find copy of mag to find the 0-130 time, but probably irrelevent on UK roads.

Got the GTEC 1, just need to fit and get checked on the RR. However want to do a std run at RR once boost gauge is fitted. How can the rev limiter be raised so that it cuts in at 7000rpm max rather than 6900?

How much is a Blueflame on its own or fitted?

i got mine for 300 quid off here second hand but was almost brand new,
the 3 inch full system new is around 450 but it gave me loads of pull against my mates coupe which before hand was exactly the same speed, hence he has bought one now.
Looking foward to see how much if anything it knocks off time down pod.

Top Gear 20vT data

Autocar 20vT Data

Autocar links are dead.

Autocar 1996

so 149 top speed eh?

That was on a high speed bowl IIRC, which will reduce the top speed a bit.

focus rs only managed 148 on millbrook bowl take 2 mph off for tyre scrub = miles slower than fords claimed 162 mph, evo mag said dissapointing. too much hype for that car, but for ford sales is the name of the game.

i have had my coop off the clock..

Top Gear managed 152.1, the extra 0.1 makes a big difference

Interesting that 50-70 acceleration in fifth gear is quoted as 6.2s, whereas I can only manage a best of 6.9s.
The test car seemed to have a slightly higher rev limit of 7000rpm too.

my car only does 150mph.........in 4th lol

so who was it that got 156 out of a coupe?
thought that was meant to be the correct top speed.
250 kph

HOW !!!!

The speedo is out, non standard wheels etc.

so either your using tractor wheels or trolley wheels

Neither, he has a raised limiter!

That might explain it.

thanks for that leighton,yes well the limiter has been raised to 7500rpm