In the words of Borat: Success!!

Just put in a fairly good guessed chip from Flea based on his experience of GT28R Coupe's, and RR-results with my new GT28R and Novitec chip (which was not very good: 1.2bar max, around 240hp @ the wheels and wet mixture all the way on boost).

First impression was a little funny, during running-in with max boost flucturating between 0.8bar and 1.4. It did however settle soon after 5-6 floorings..

Now it hits a stable 1.3bar however I floor it, and it still holds 1.15bar @ 6000rpm.. If I read right, everything's pretty fussy at full steam..

The next RR-session's coming up and maybe some adjustments, the chip is reprogrammable.

It goes like a rocket already though!
I too join the Flea fanclub.

Other mods:
Garrett GT28R, matched to manifold
Matched manifold to head
New EBV: GM/Adelco (std Bosch Motronic boostcontrol)
FMIC (Raceitaly), flowprepped *new*
Custom FMIC short piping with heat protection *new*
Larger IC-intake in bumper
Forge DV006, green spring
Modded airfilterbox, 4" trumpet (std paper filter)
NGK BKR7EIX-iridium plugs, 0.9mm gap *new* changed to 0.7mm *newer*
Direct cable fuelpump
By-passed throttlehouse heating
Mobil1 5W-50 oil

Gearbox:
Castrol TAF-X fully synth oil
Alfa GTA clutch *new*

Exaust:
Fully custom stainless
3" downpipe
3" 300-cells metal cat
Double lambdaplugs
2.5" from cat
Double large full flow silencers

Per was a non-believer at first but as they say, proof of the mapping is in the boosting

That's a misunderstanding, I've believed in your business all along.

I just could'nt get why my car behaved like it did after swapping turbo and I did'nt understand your explanation.
Looking back at it I still not fully understand but you were certainly right!

.

Guessed is Swedish for very clever

So are you happy with 1.3bar holding 1.2bar, I didn't feel like taking it much further with your Pace sidemount.

For now yes, I'd like to know my inlet temps next week. If there is room for more boost why not, right? I still have all the safety features of the Motronic.

If the temps seem high I'm going FMIC right away.

Nice work Flea when my GTiR turbo goes on and FMIC I'll DEFINITELY be wanting it live mapped by yourself "Stage 2" as you mention on your site

Congratulations Per, let us know about the results when you take for another RR

Good job Flea. I'm looking forward for my remote mapping

Not sure if most people know, but Per is running an uprated GM EBV so the boost is controlled via the ecu.

Didi, yes GTi-R is a stage 2

Hani, whenever you are ready

uprated GM EBV what is it,and being that your so far away for me,how dose the remote mapping work

The GM ebv is a replacement for the standard coupe ebv. It works better at controlling boost, especially overboost and eliminating the see-saw effect. If you don't want to run a PRV or EBC, then this is the best way for controlling the boost. It also retains the ecu safety function which reduces the boost threshold according to inlet temperatures.

I'm also curious as to how this remote mapping works

I'm guessing it's the following:

You tell flea your engine spec
Flea creates chip suitable to your mods
Flea send chip to you
You put chip in and get it on the RR
You tell flea RR results (power, AFR)
Flea makes minor adjustments on the chip and sends you a new chip (providing the AFR is incorrect)

Correctomundo!
It's a reprogrammable chip tho. Or is the cost of the chip less than the shipping, Leighton?

Morewise; I've been driving some more and I have to say it's also more driveable than before, responsive, smoother and earlier boost. I'll make a 2x500km trip this weekend and see how that goes.

I assume you are running a safe/standard ignition map unless flea can hear det from Sweden

Standard no, safe yes...

I had my hybrid fitted a couple of weeks ago by Rog at pwoeritalia along with a GTEC1 then fitted my FMIC last weekend and it felt considerably quicker with those mods. However after being mapped by Flea yesterday it has totally transformed the car. The driveability just feels so much better and FCCUK is it quick now. If you're adding mods and expect them to work on their own think again, go get a Flea map!

might sound like a stupid question, but if remoting mapping is the way forward, what is the current benifit from traveling down to flea's workshop (apart from being able to stare at the wonders of flea)

Good question Karl

Maybe someone from UK shall try the remote mapping and then go to Flea for another mapping and compare the results to see the difference.

I think for remote mapping, Flea is considering safety more and more.

Time, id imagine. If you get it remote mapped you'll have to wait for the map to be written, then the time it takes to receive it, then a RR session, ad infinatum until the results are correct.

Anyway after seeing the work Flea does quite how anyone wouldnt want to drive it the same day its done baffles me, i personally couldnt bare the suspense...and it wasnt even on my car!

remote mapping is all well and good, but no substitute for mapping the actual car. Flea would have to use a chip that he has done for a car with similar spec, and there will be variences from car to car - hence the need for a rolling road check and revision of the map (which still involves travelling time.) I would only consider it as an option if you are not in the UK.

100% agree, well worth the 6 hours of driving to get done. And the drive home was worth it alone (had to pull into the services to calm myself down a bit at one point!)

Agreed, if I was in UK I definately would've done it live!

fair point, well put.

Just need to not be so lazy sometimes

so does this chip replace the GTEC1 chip location?

Also i'm still wondering how a custom chip works with an EBC ?? surely flea's chip is telling the ECU to do one thing and the EBC is trying to control another, i just don't understand lol.

I'm really interested and just want to learn, i will have to get done to flea's and have a good old chin wag (obviously whilst the car is being set up)

With a mapped chip you don't need any external extra boostcontroller.

but the standard EBV isn't capable of holding boost properly ??? hence why i am currently running a Armval PRV.

I've bought a HKS EBC for when the new turbo is installed, are you saying that I would be better off running the PRV instead of an EBC ?

depends - if you run the standard ebv then I think you do. If you run an uprated one then maybe not...

After changing to GT28R, the std EBV worked almost as good on mine (the problem really seem to be in the combination with small std turbo). The GM/Adelco was just that little more stable as I remember it.

IMHO I cannot see why anybody would like to use a Armval/PRV/ApexiContoller or whatever when you can have a good mapping from Flea.

one good advantage with an EBC is that you can have different boost levels . I really wouldn't fancy driving around with the highest boost setting all the time.

Well you don't HAVE to boot it all the time..

And, if your missus is driving it you could always just unplug the EBV; voila - baseboost!

i was just thinking that as with my greedy i have three setting

On my Blitz EBC channel 4 = Nutty b**tard full on will race anything setting 3 = Fast setting 2 = Every day driving, 1 = Wife setting. I really wouldn't want the missus to experience channel 4!

excatly, i would love to have a flea map (as my fastest option) but then be able to "turn it down" now and again for long journeys and for when the misses is wanting a go.

really could do with an answer from flea on this.

or opinions anyone?

When you have multiple boost settings with an EBC you modify the boost but not the fueling...

Hypothesis :

"If your car is mapped at 1.2 bar for example, the fueling will be ok at this pressure. But if you set 1.4 or 1.5 bar with the EBC you will probably run too lean"

"If your car is mapped on the max boost you plan to run... and you set a lower boost you will be too rich"

This is only hypothesis but is this right guys? And if yes, it means we need one different eprom for each EBC setting (to run rightly and safely)

What are your past experience about that?

I think you are correct MiniPit.

My Dad's old rally car, had a switch which allowed him to flick between 2 different maps. One which is balls out and one where all the boost and ignition is right down, for driving between stages.

I'm confident Leighton could sort something like that out, for anyone that really wanted one

I'm quite sure Leighton can map to different boost levels, with help of a Bigger MAF. He'll be along soon.

But if you are using an electronic boost controller, the ECU has no way of knowing the boost level you are running. I *think* there is just 1 map for fuelling and ignition, as MiniPit said, and when adjusting boost it will therefore alter how it fuels slightly ie. more boost = leaner, less boost = richer

Im also sure that leighton can map the fuelling at different levels

Ben

Yes you are quite right eldinho, my apologies

As punishment you can come and polish my car for me

Pffffffffffffffffft......... do i have to?

so.... now i'm wondering whats the better solution for me?

EBC so that I can set differnet boost levels dependant on the situation

or

The wonders of Flea-mapping but i'm stuck with the one setting.

Is it too much to ask to have both?

Flea can map your car with an EBC if you take it to him. In fact its probably the most common way he does it??

But if you use remote mapping then he will want to set the boost using the ECU which uses an EBV (prefably uprated).

One disadvantage of not letting the ECU control the boost (EBV)is you lose some safety features.

I tkink you are right Mini but don't forget the role of the lambda probe.
Is the lambda probe able to regulate the mixture? (beetween a boost set to 1b4 with an EBC and a boost set up at 1b2 for example?)

The Lamda is only used when you are at idle / off boost.

humm ok

Open or closed loop RULE Chris

ouep

what?

"ouep" means "Yeah" in French

ah - makes sense now!!

Did a well needed rebuild (SMIC to FMIC).
This reduced the max inlet temps from 65 to 28degrees, reduced the boost a little, but upped power with around 15hp.

The Kit (same as in current GB)

Some finishing needed

Finished, smoother

Getting there

Straight turbo - IC pipe

Bumper on

So; the newest graphs looks like this:

Graph 1 (hp@wheels, Nm@wheels, boost, lambda)

Graph 2 (hp@wheels, Nm@wheels, pressure before IC, after IC, temp(F) after IC)

Results in figures;
# 267hp @ the wheels / 6700rpm at 1.03bar
# 340Nm @ the wheels / 5300rpm at 1.2bar
# max 28.3deg C after IC, 20deg C ambient.
# Shell 99 octane

It's rather nice, this car.
So nice the clutch gave up on me. It does not slip but makes loads of vibrations.. That said, it's stock factory and done 193000km's. Fiat Quality!

Next step is a little more boost, now that I have decent cooling. (and a new GTA clutch..)

Well actually it was my demand to use the ECU/EBV. You can buy a map from Flea and use it with a EBC if you want to (why you would I don't really know).

Clutch changed (GTA), Flea map 2.0 is in the car and settled in!
Adjustment has been made to ign.timing, fuelmap and boost - with a nice new feature...

I now have a boost of 1.3bar before 3000rpm, then at around 4800rpm it rises to ca 1.45bar, after that sloping to ca 1.3bar over 6000rpm.
Haven't yet got any explanation from Leighton about this little feature, but I suspect it'll save my transmission etc. from the worst torque-bursts..?

Needless to say - it goes LIKE STINK now..
Until I've done the next RR-session I don't know much, but I suspect I need a Warlbro fuelpump.. I've noticed some misfirings at full whack, high revs.
According to JohnS the std pump is out of it's depth over 310hp.

Yet my first theory was bad sparks, that's exactly what it felt like.
I now have NGK Iridium BKR7EIX with 0.9mm gaps. Maybe I shouldn't have changed it from factorys 0.75mm? (was reading Fiat's book; "0.7mm to 0.9mm gap recommended".)
What do you think?

If it's the pump, exactly what pump should I use and where to buy it?

For your level of tuning, I guess you need an uprated fuel pump (Walbro 355lph, GSS340 model) with the wiring mod.

In UK, you can get it from here: Walbro 255lph. Not sure about Sweden though.

What injectors do you use? standard? it's not mentioned earlier on the thread.

Ok! Thanks for the link. Things are usually cheapest in UK with that weak £..
I have a list of mods on my first page. Injectors are std.
It seems the problem lies in the plugs right now. Fuelling is ok. Will less the gap to 0.6mm.

for sure!

We'll see!

I do know now, I have fuelling on full boost on fifth gear up to 6000rpm (ca 1.3bar) (where we stopped, foolishly. Will have to do a full rpm session again on fifth gear).

The misfires were down to 0.9mm gap on the Iridium plugs. With 0.7mm gap all was good again!

I'm a happy chap with a great Coupe. On fourth gear the load on the rollers was low so I only got 1.14bar/275.2whp at most.
Will do another round (in 5th) when the snow melts next spring.

Here's one graph from the latest RR-session (with misfire; seen as the small dip).

If anybody's interested in my process of changing to a GT28R there's a long project thread with lots of pic's HERE.

Anyway, it seems this project is finished now.

The car is MUCH more drivable than before with great off-boost behaviour and some ferocious thrust up the revs, especially at 5000rpm where the 1.45bar kicks in..
On top of that, it's more frugal than before.

I'm very happy with Flea's service and will recommend him to anybody here in Sweden too.

good work Per & flea,,, he did it with me before and here you go

keep up the good work and enjoy the car to the max

Great work Per, I enjoyed 'looking at the pictures in your Swedish thread, just how I read my books that! ......

Per, what are those wheels you have on your car, I think they look great?

Phil

Don't they? Thanks!
They are Liquidmetal Static 18x7.5" with pcd 4x100mm and ET45. So with 8mm hubcentric spacers and wobbly bolts they fit perfectly.
I bought them (CHEAP!) at discounttiredirect.com

I'd like to add; the biggest (and for me, the only) downside of having the ECU boostcontrol: The difficulty to get the correct reading on RR-sessions (less load - lot less boost).
As mentioned earlier, I got 275whp at 1.14bar (max 1.31bar)
What I get on road, with 1.3bar (max 1.45bar), I have no idea.
Yet.