First test with only 1bar - from Greece

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First test with only 1bar - from Greece #1062293 30/06/2010 22:11 30/06/2010 22:11
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	hello mates!!! I have almost finished my car and expect September to finish finally my car I have settings only until 1bar and this is because came too early the summer in GREECE here's a short video with just 1bar http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaeN8VBomps Last edited by george20vt; 30/06/2010 22:13.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062364 01/07/2010 08:31 01/07/2010 08:31
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,194 Göteborg, Sweden Freddan72 Competition Level
Freddan72 Competition Level Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,194 Göteborg, Sweden	Hi George! It sounds so raw and beautiful. Can you give us the spec of the car? Coupé Fiat 20V Turbo Plus 1999, T19 Mitsubishi turbo https://youtu.be/O9qrLj3Ap00 Now FCP Stage3!

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: Freddan72] #1062390 01/07/2010 09:31 01/07/2010 09:31
S samsite999 Unregistered
samsite999 Unregistered S	Why does it sound like a 16vt? it also has a 16vt dash?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062406 01/07/2010 10:03 01/07/2010 10:03
P Paul_H Unregistered
Paul_H Unregistered P	Originally Posted by samsite999 Why does it sound like a 16vt? it also has a 16vt dash? looks like it has had an engine transplant, with a homemade tubular manifold click click again very impressive looking George

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: Freddan72] #1062537 01/07/2010 12:59 01/07/2010 12:59
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by Freddan72 Hi George! It sounds so raw and beautiful. Can you give us the spec of the car? thank you mate! some specs 20vt engine with 20v head wossner forged pistons 9,2:1 compression novitec con rods GT30R with 0.64 a/r turbine housing Tial external wastegate 38mm handmade turbo manifold 70mm exhaust Turborevs fmic 60x30x7,5 handmade i/c pipes handmade induction pipe 100mm K&N filter Kinsler injectors 650cc Wlbro 255l/h ECU programmer A.Roumelis 17inch OZ Superleggera Yokohama Parada spec2 205/40/17 Bilstein with LowTech springs Last edited by george20vt; 02/07/2010 18:26.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062544 01/07/2010 13:03 01/07/2010 13:03
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by samsite999 Why does it sound like a 16vt? it also has a 16vt dash? it is 20vt mate! it is 1996 model after this year they change the dash from electronic clock to analog.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062547 01/07/2010 13:05 01/07/2010 13:05
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by Paul_H Originally Posted by samsite999 Why does it sound like a 16vt? it also has a 16vt dash? looks like it has had an engine transplant, with a homemade tubular manifold click click again very impressive looking George correctly!!! but not now before 3 years ago Last edited by george20vt; 01/07/2010 13:06.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062563 01/07/2010 13:21 01/07/2010 13:21
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Nice vid Originally Posted by george20vt 20vt engine with 20v head Are they not the same head except sodium ex valves and camshafts? Any work here i.e portwork/valve seat/guides etc I assume you put the 20VT ex valves in?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062681 01/07/2010 17:04 01/07/2010 17:04
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Nice vid Originally Posted by george20vt 20vt engine with 20v head Are they not the same head except sodium ex valves and camshafts? Any work here i.e portwork/valve seat/guides etc I assume you put the 20VT ex valves in? the 20v head is litle bigger from tourbo

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1062697 01/07/2010 17:23 01/07/2010 17:23
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Are you talking about port size or valve size? What about the ex-valves? Also how did you achieve the 9:2 CR with Wossners pistons that are 8:1 CR?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063269 02/07/2010 18:25 02/07/2010 18:25
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Are you talking about port size or valve size? What about the ex-valves? Also how did you achieve the 9:2 CR with Wossners pistons that are 8:1 CR? The whole 20v head is a little bigger than 20vt port size,valves etc.. The Wossners i have take is oversize pistons (82,5mm)and for 9 CR (stock is 8,5)(8 is for 16vt) with the treatment that received the head to shut the motor gained 0.2 extra compression

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063271 02/07/2010 18:27 02/07/2010 18:27
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	here one more video 0-400m http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5a3IdI1Ckc

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063370 02/07/2010 23:00 02/07/2010 23:00
Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 50 portugal 20vtplus Reaping the fruits
20vtplus Reaping the fruits Joined: Apr 2010 Posts: 50 portugal	In the movie it seems that you used a gt3071r .... How did you put an external wastegate?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: 20vtplus] #1063488 03/07/2010 10:26 03/07/2010 10:26
N Nievelc Unregistered
Nievelc Unregistered N	That sounds absolutely fan-tab-abloshious! well done mate!

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063510 03/07/2010 11:42 03/07/2010 11:42
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Originally Posted by george20vt The whole 20v head is a little bigger than 20vt port size,valves etc.. The Wossners i have take is oversize pistons (82,5mm)and for 9 CR (stock is 8,5)(8 is for 16vt) with the treatment that received the head to shut the motor gained 0.2 extra compression Ok so last question is what ex-valves did you use?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063617 03/07/2010 17:20 03/07/2010 17:20
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Originally Posted by george20vt The whole 20v head is a little bigger than 20vt port size,valves etc.. The Wossners i have take is oversize pistons (82,5mm)and for 9 CR (stock is 8,5)(8 is for 16vt) with the treatment that received the head to shut the motor gained 0.2 extra compression Ok so last question is what ex-valves did you use? stock from 20v!

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: 20vtplus] #1063619 03/07/2010 17:25 03/07/2010 17:25
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by 20vtplus In the movie it seems that you used a gt3071r .... How did you put an external wastegate? it is the same family GT30 GT3071R GT3071R - 700382-3 GT3071R - 700382-20 GT3076R - 700382-12 but mine is the old GT30R this turbine and GT3076 works only with external gate

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1063667 03/07/2010 19:24 03/07/2010 19:24
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,194 Göteborg, Sweden Freddan72 Competition Level
Freddan72 Competition Level Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,194 Göteborg, Sweden	So what is the main goal with the engine tuning? Of course you want more power, don't we all , but do you want to reach 450HP? Any pics of the car? Coupé Fiat 20V Turbo Plus 1999, T19 Mitsubishi turbo https://youtu.be/O9qrLj3Ap00 Now FCP Stage3!

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1064188 04/07/2010 23:21 04/07/2010 23:21
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Originally Posted by george20vt stock from 20v! From my understanding the 20VT inlet valve diameter is 30mm and the exhaust valve diameter is 26mm. The 20V’s valves are exactly the same size as the 20VT, even the head casting is the same so where did you measure that the 20V head is bigger than the 20VT as standard? The only difference I was aware of is the 20VT uses a different camshaft and sodium filled ex valves.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: Freddan72] #1065645 07/07/2010 13:44 07/07/2010 13:44
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by Freddan72 So what is the main goal with the engine tuning? Of course you want more power, don't we all , but do you want to reach 450HP? Any pics of the car? first,Our primary goal is to make a pretty fast car, who can go ride and other illegal races in the street or legal races in the track secondly, to overcome many of the 500

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1065651 07/07/2010 13:58 07/07/2010 13:58
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Originally Posted by george20vt stock from 20v! From my understanding the 20VT inlet valve diameter is 30mm and the exhaust valve diameter is 26mm. The 20V’s valves are exactly the same size as the 20VT, even the head casting is the same so where did you measure that the 20V head is bigger than the 20VT as standard? The only difference I was aware of is the 20VT uses a different camshaft and sodium filled ex valves. I asked my engineer what has been done to head he said the following we did not touch the camshafts because it is litle bigger than 20vt but we touch the inlet valves and we have place 34mm valves and 30mm at the exhaust.. also we have make improve the flow apologize because I remembered that we had not done anything to head! Last edited by george20vt; 07/07/2010 14:00.

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1065892 07/07/2010 21:15 07/07/2010 21:15
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Originally Posted by TurboJ we did not touch the camshafts because it is litle bigger than 20vt What do you mean by this? Did you use the 20V cams?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1067135 09/07/2010 17:03 09/07/2010 17:03
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Originally Posted by TurboJ we did not touch the camshafts because it is litle bigger than 20vt What do you mean by this? Did you use the 20V cams? yes!

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1067222 09/07/2010 19:48 09/07/2010 19:48
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	Why?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1067410 10/07/2010 06:11 10/07/2010 06:11
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ Why? because my engineer says that the 20v camshafts are litle bigger from 20vt and this we need because the engine goes over 7500rpms

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1067684 10/07/2010 21:28 10/07/2010 21:28
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	I can't see how the 20V cams are "bigger". Ignoring the phase variator the 20VT inlet cams have a peak lift of 9.3mm and a total duration of 244°. The 20V has a peak lift of 9mm and a total duration of 238°. It's the same for the exhaust cam the 20VT has a peak lift of 9mm and a total duration of 220° whereas the 20V has a peak lift of 8mm and a total duration of 209. Looking at these timing figures at face value would show that using the 20V cam gives less lift and duration therefore they are not “bigger” but “smaller”. I understand that having less duration and lift on turbo cams will increase higher rpm grunt for the sacrifice of low speed torque. I understand why you engineer has chosen the 20V cams but the question that springs to mind is what rpm are you aiming for? You say it goes over 7500rpm but by how much?

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1067893 11/07/2010 11:43 11/07/2010 11:43
G george20vt Unregistered
george20vt Unregistered G	Originally Posted by TurboJ I can't see how the 20V cams are "bigger". Ignoring the phase variator the 20VT inlet cams have a peak lift of 9.3mm and a total duration of 244°. The 20V has a peak lift of 9mm and a total duration of 238°. It's the same for the exhaust cam the 20VT has a peak lift of 9mm and a total duration of 220° whereas the 20V has a peak lift of 8mm and a total duration of 209. Looking at these timing figures at face value would show that using the 20V cam gives less lift and duration therefore they are not “bigger” but “smaller”. I understand that having less duration and lift on turbo cams will increase higher rpm grunt for the sacrifice of low speed torque. I understand why you engineer has chosen the 20V cams but the question that springs to mind is what rpm are you aiming for? You say it goes over 7500rpm but by how much? i agree with you but with the harder valves springs will reach approximately the 8200-8400rpms but with a safety limit for the motor the 8500rpms my safety limit at will be 7800rpms max 8000rpms I'm 100% sure that the cams that has the motor is the 20v's and that is definitely larger than the 20vt. maybe my engineer have done somehing and it keep it for a surprise when we go for dyno because i asked for him over 500ps and 8000rpms when i lern i will post it

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1068103 11/07/2010 18:18 11/07/2010 18:18
T TurboJ Unregistered
TurboJ Unregistered T	To rev really high and to use the 20V cams to their full potential I believe you need to ditch the hydraulic tappets and go to shims. I think that you will see not see benefit but only a loss in torque using the 20V cams and not revving past 8000rpm to gain the power back. I think the limit of the hydraulic is around 8500rpm. If you can't rev that high then you should consider putting the 20VT cams and gaining your torque back. Unless you do a before and after dyno for 20VT cams vs 20V cams there will be no real evidence of how well suited using the 20V cam really is. It will be interesting to see how you get on with your dyno graphs. So keep us posted

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: ] #1068791 12/07/2010 22:58 12/07/2010 22:58
Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 707 TurboNick Enjoying the ride
TurboNick Enjoying the ride Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 707	Should be some interesting results from this coop, that looks flipping fast at 1 bar and sound amazing. Bravo yiorgo, fenete san boli yriyoro autokinito

Re: First test with only 1bar - from Greece [Re: TurboNick] #1068849 13/07/2010 07:21 13/07/2010 07:21
I I8AV8 Unregistered
I8AV8 Unregistered I	No need for both harder springs or solid lifters on the 20VT. The oil port on the hydraulic shim is 1.50mm and by decreasing the diameter of the oil port you will decrease the hydraulic valve's tendency to bounch at high revs due to higher oil pressure inside the hydraulic shim. You can weld the port and then re-drill it.

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