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Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442848
14/08/2013 17:26
14/08/2013 17:26
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,079
Chertsey in the Thames
bockers Offline
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Rising house prices mean nothing to those on the ladder already, and neither do falling prices either. Just why the Daily Mail is so obsessed is beyond me, perhaps it's because the express has the monopoly on Diana front pages and the Star nabbed Jordan.

Strangely the only thing that is good for house owners is inflation, providing your wages track it. Mortgage as a % of salary actually decreases. But inflation is wrong confused

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442868
14/08/2013 20:08
14/08/2013 20:08
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
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AndrewR Offline
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Northumberland
Originally Posted By: Emjay
Why is it better than going down in price, unless downsizing?


A lot of 40-somethings have ageing baby-boomer parents, who were the first generation of the expanding middle-class who went for home ownership in a big way.

And the brake lines on mobility scooters are very prone to damage.


Dear monos, a secret truth.
Re: House prices [Re: bockers] #1442870
14/08/2013 20:10
14/08/2013 20:10
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
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AndrewR Offline
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Originally Posted By: bockers
But inflation is wrong confused


But inflation is a direct result of a booming economy, where there are more people with more to spend, so inflation's a sign that good things are happening confused confused


Dear monos, a secret truth.
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442911
15/08/2013 04:46
15/08/2013 04:46
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,106
South Cambs
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Barmybob Offline
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South Cambs
Originally Posted By: Emjay
In reality I am £100,000 in my pocket better off and have exactly the same roof over my head.


Yes but we live in the UK where paying more for anything means it must be better, even if folk must sink themselves into larger levels of debt to be able to obtain it. Had I the option I would have continued to rent, just as many of my friends in Germany still choose to do. Unfortunately in the UK the renting sector is a joke with it often costing more to rent than to buy. So I had to buy when I came back.

House prices in the UK have to rise for our economy to recover. Britains wealth comes from Finance, moving money about and the Housing market is one of the largest sectors.

Sadly Top gear was wrong, manufacturing in the UK is tiny compared to our big European partners. It's only a small proportion of the UK economy, unfortunately we need the finance sector to do well to recover. So, despite what we are told, more debt (Larger Mortgages) is the key to our growth.


Gone Audi mad!
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442916
15/08/2013 06:51
15/08/2013 06:51
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,133
ation
szkom Offline
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ation
The illusion of wealth. Take a 100k house owned by a 30k income household. Increase its value based on some arbitrary reasoning, and voilà you now have millions of people who are "better off".

The only reason house price increases are a good thing.

Re: House prices [Re: AndrewR] #1442919
15/08/2013 07:12
15/08/2013 07:12
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,837
Haslemere, Surrey
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Mark_S Offline
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Originally Posted By: AndrewR
Originally Posted By: bockers
But inflation is wrong confused


But inflation is a direct result of a booming economy, where there are more people with more to spend, so inflation's a sign that good things are happening confused confused


But hyper-inflation as you know is bad (Germany 1920/30s), so I wonder where the boundary is? I am not exactly sure what the critical drivers of inflation are, but I'd guess that it must be product of demand out-stripping supply, with those that can afford it getting access to materials and some others by definition missing out. Personally I wish we could have an objective of sustainable economic activity at something like today's level with a 0% inflation target.


997 C4S
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442920
15/08/2013 07:32
15/08/2013 07:32

P
patch234
Unregistered
patch234
Unregistered
P



The same applies to what makes a diamond expensive - we simply all agree that it is......

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442929
15/08/2013 07:49
15/08/2013 07:49
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,793
Berlin
barnacle Offline
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Berlin
That and the fact that 80-90% of all the ones ever dug up are kept in a vault and never sold...


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Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442930
15/08/2013 07:49
15/08/2013 07:49
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,603
Corridor of Uncertainty
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Jim_Clennell Offline
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Unfortunately, as I understand it, 0% inflation would more or less mean 0% growth and it seems that growth is the holy grail. Maintenance of a level of economic activity (unless at full employment) is not deemed good enough.

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442946
15/08/2013 09:16
15/08/2013 09:16
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,581
London
MrCooper Offline
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Posts: 2,581
London
Originally Posted By: Emjay
Going back, again, to my original point in case someone can answer it... ?

Well, I can answer it for you, but only by repeating what you and I have already said...

Originally Posted By: Emjay
Why is it better than going down in price, unless downsizing?

It isn't for anyone except those who are on their "final rung" of the ladder from which they will only move downwards or off

Originally Posted By: Emjay
Aren't people deluding themselves that they are better off? ?

Yes, except those who were "final rung" occupants pre 2003 and the problem is compounded the further you are off that date

Originally Posted By: Emjay
Okay, I buy house A for £200,000 when I would rather buy house B for £400,000...

House prices go up by 25%. I sell house A for £250,000. Whoopee, how rich I am. I need only to get my hands on a further £250,000 to now buy B.

If prices went down by 25%. I sell house A for £150,000. Yar boo, how poor I am. I need to get my hands on £150,000 to buy B.

In reality I am £100,000 in my pocket better off and have exactly the same roof over my head.


This is bang on.
Of course if you bought the £400k house in or before 2001 it will have since at least doubled in value. So long as this was your final step on the property ladder then you are laughing all the way to the bank, or at least be very comfortable in the knowledge you that you will have left a great asset for your children. However, given your likely age in such a situation, it might be more true to say that you think you are laughing all the way to the bank, but give it 20 years when you have sat "emptynesting" for a couple of decades preventing a young family from moving in then carehome bills will eat up 50% of your house value. This will mean the doubling of value you experienced will be eroded and actually the winner will be the shareholders in the carehome companies.




Ex Grigio Moon 20VT Plus
Ex 350Z
Now Aston Martin Vantage

Re: House prices [Re: MrCooper] #1442952
15/08/2013 09:38
15/08/2013 09:38
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,603
Corridor of Uncertainty
J
Jim_Clennell Offline
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Originally Posted By: MrCooper
...the winner will be the shareholders in the carehome companies.



This is exactly what I've been thinking.

My first wife's dad had a great idea for he and his wife plus a dozen selected family and friends to chip in to buy a hotel on the Isle of Wight (cheap as chips at the time) and select and recruit staff to run their own retirement/care home.

I always thought that was a better idea than paying for some overworked, under-qualified minimum-wage-slave "carer" to slap you around and pour your own wee on your head in a private home.

(Please note, I exaggerate for humorous effect, I'm not denigrating all care-home workers).

Sadly the idea came to nowt, as he and his wife died before it became an issue.


Last edited by Jim_Clennell; 15/08/2013 09:40.
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442955
15/08/2013 09:59
15/08/2013 09:59
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,294
Portsmouth
A
ali_hire Offline
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Portsmouth
Originally Posted By: Emjay
Going back to my original point, "Why?" Unless you are downsizing or it is an investment property what is the benefit of prices going up?


I can give you a reason why it's a good thing.

But it's a very selfish one and I'll get a torrent of abuse.

Re: House prices [Re: ali_hire] #1442956
15/08/2013 10:12
15/08/2013 10:12

P
patch234
Unregistered
patch234
Unregistered
P



Originally Posted By: ali_hire


But it's a very selfish one and I'll get a torrent of abuse.


Selfish B*****d wink

He's right!

Re: House prices [Re: ali_hire] #1442959
15/08/2013 10:21
15/08/2013 10:21
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
A
AndrewR Offline
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Northumberland
Originally Posted By: ali_hire
I can give you a reason why it's a good thing.

But it's a very selfish one and I'll get a torrent of abuse.


Is it that thing you were telling us about how you befriend lonely old ladies with big houses, then let the friendship become romance and , finally, marry them ... just before their tragic 'accident'?

Cos that is quite selfish, I suppose.

Speaking of which, when are you getting married?


Dear monos, a secret truth.
Re: House prices [Re: ali_hire] #1442965
15/08/2013 11:31
15/08/2013 11:31
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,581
London
MrCooper Offline
I need some sleep
MrCooper  Offline
I need some sleep

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,581
London
Originally Posted By: ali_hire
Originally Posted By: Emjay
Going back to my original point, "Why?" Unless you are downsizing or it is an investment property what is the benefit of prices going up?


I can give you a reason why it's a good thing.

But it's a very selfish one and I'll get a torrent of abuse.


He manages a carehome?

Either that or a block flats which have become the only option for the local generation rent community now that all the normal starter homes are out of their price range? Price falls equal redundancy...



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Ex 350Z
Now Aston Martin Vantage

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442967
15/08/2013 12:15
15/08/2013 12:15
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,732
Surrey
E
Emjay Offline OP
Forum is my life
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Surrey
It's worse than that. I can reveal Al writes headlines for the Daily Mail.

On the downside, scientists believe that writing headlines for the Daily Mail may cause cancer. On the plus side, since writing that, scientists have now discovered that writing headlines for the Daily Mail in fact may prevent cancer and may cause house prices to rise.


Does our law condemn a man without first hearing him to find out what he has been doing? (John 7:51)
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442970
15/08/2013 12:18
15/08/2013 12:18
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,603
Corridor of Uncertainty
J
Jim_Clennell Offline
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Corridor of Uncertainty
Also, 5 million gay asylum-seeking scientists are on benefits.

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442971
15/08/2013 12:18
15/08/2013 12:18
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
A
AndrewR Offline
I AM a Coop
AndrewR  Offline
I AM a Coop
A

Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,546
Northumberland
What would the Daily Mail do if we switched our currency to the cancer standard?


Dear monos, a secret truth.
Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442973
15/08/2013 12:21
15/08/2013 12:21
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 16,603
Corridor of Uncertainty
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Jim_Clennell Offline
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Corridor of Uncertainty
Boom and bust.

Re: House prices [Re: Emjay] #1442981
15/08/2013 12:40
15/08/2013 12:40
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,294
Portsmouth
A
ali_hire Offline
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Portsmouth
Originally Posted By: AndrewR
Originally Posted By: ali_hire
I can give you a reason why it's a good thing.

But it's a very selfish one and I'll get a torrent of abuse.


Is it that thing you were telling us about how you befriend lonely old ladies with big houses, then let the friendship become romance and , finally, marry them ... just before their tragic 'accident'?

Cos that is quite selfish, I suppose.


I did have a client once who I was convinced would write me into his will. He loved me, in a totally non-aggressive way, but then moved to Cornwall and I never heard from him again.

Still, since marrying Laura I've discovered that the NHS will give me a £40k lump sum in the event of her death. So, every cloud and all that.

Originally Posted By: Emjay
It's worse than that. I can reveal Al writes headlines for the Daily Mail.


That's libellous, Mark.

Can you recommend a good lawyer to take on a defamation case please?

Re: House prices [Re: Jim_Clennell] #1442996
15/08/2013 13:48
15/08/2013 13:48
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,793
Berlin
barnacle Offline
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Berlin
Originally Posted By: Jim_Clennell
select and recruit staff to run their own retirement/care home


My brother-in-law had that same idea. Fortunately for all concerned, nothing came of it...


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