how do you turn the boost up on a standerd 20v turbo last owner said he turned it down? cheers

Welcome!

The standard 20vt has an Electronic Boost valve (EBV) - this is not adjustable and is controlled by the ECU. Many people fit non standard boost controllers so they can alter the boost, either manual (like a valve - sometimes called PRVs) or electronic controllers like Apexi AVC-R.

Its likely you have a PRV. Do a search for the fitting guide and it will tell you where it is, what it looks like and how to adjust it.

First word of warning. When messing with boost you don't want to turn it up too much, plus your asking for trouble if you haven't got a boost gauge.

Chris

cheers i will do that now and let ya know

Hi!
I had installed Gizzmo IBC electronic boost controller


AFR is good except it was decreased at boost rising part (3000-4000) to prevent detonation by the power-box on MAF sensor.
Peak boost is 1.4 bar and 0.7 at 6700.
Dyno results:
249.5 hp at 4830
374.2 Nm at 4410


the question is - since several time running, fuel cut takes place but boost pressure and revs is the same at one moment but not the same at another time. 1.2bar - 3000, 1.4 bar - 3800. I suspect that ECU have overboost warning that is operating by MAF signal. Does anyone know something about it?

fit a gtec 1 chip from grahaml on the forum and this will raise the boost to 1.2bar .

I have this chip but adaptation in ECU eliminates its eployment through 5 miles of the ride(((

This chip, as I know, raise the boost to 1.2 bar just at 1,2 gears but I have this phenomenon with fuel cut at all of gears...

Maybe it's knocking. Is the injector light coming on at all? Or maybe a misfire judging by the flat spots on the graph, although the graph looks a bit weird as bhp/torque don't cross in the usual place.

How do the spark plugs look? Have you had a proper fuelling test carried out?

Graham,

Graph shows BHP and torgue in NM and therefore they don't cross.
Blue line is torgue in NM, red one power and the third one is most likely boost.

-Jari-

That's correct: hp, Nm and boost in bar (100 - 0 bar, 240 = 100+140 - 1.4 bar).

Spark plugs look good - grey and dry.
All injectors was checked and cleared.
Fuel pump was tested on the ride and it's good but It really can be slowly dying but it can't be sure in this question.

Before, I had twitching on 0.7 bar reaching and it went away with replacement of the ignition coil of 2 cylinder where I saw small black nagar on the piston.
I had no overboost but I don't know the reason: soft wastegate actuator or ECU warning...

Thanks, I understand the graph better now.

The ECU overboost fuel cut is set at 1.5 bar on a standard chip and is raised even higher on a Gtec1, so it's not that unless there's a problem with the AFM.

What do you mean by the "power-box on MAF sensor"?

I mean little scheme that changes MAF signal. Input signal are MAF signal and first injector's signal.
It's one kind of power box that make the ECU seeing wrong/larger signal of air flow to increase the fuel supply.

Do I understand correctly - boost cut is set 1.5 bar and ECU calculates it on MAF signal?

One more thing: this fuel cut takes place after normal running for a long time and it turns normal again after stop the engine. It likes an accumulative parameter.

Yes, with the standard chip fuel cut is set at 1.5 bar from the MAF signal. With the Gtec1 it's even higher, but you're only hitting 1.4 bar anyway so it's definitely not the ECU cutting fuel due to boost.

Of course it may be the ECU cutting fuel due to some other problem.

Have you tried reading the ECU for error codes? Even if the warning light isn't on there can still be errors stored so definitely get the codes checked if you haven't already.

What happens if you reset the ECU (disconnect battery for 1 min)? Does it change when this fuel cut problem occurs?

1.4 was on the dyno. On the road, due to harder load, it blew 1.8 so I got to decrease duty set of EBC but now I have peaks of 1.5-1.6 bar caused by turbo inertness. And MAF signal is increased as well.
I already used to get nothing with ECU reading)))) The only parameter - adaptation. Only once I had it about 3% while most 20vt have 5-7%. The last times I had 10-30%. Even I disconnect the ECU from the battery Incan get something different only for about 5 miles until adaptation became the same.

If the standard EBV is disconnected and replaced byt the boost controller then the ECU learning/adapation function shouldn't be affecting the boost level at all.

Is the EBV definitely disconnected or is the boost controller valve somehow in series or parallel with it?

Either way, I'd have a play with the settings on the boost controller, you shouldn't be getting such inconsistent boost. Aim for 1.4 bar (or less) max overboost and 1.2 bar max sustained boost.

Original EBV stills on it's place because of my fear of inadequate reaction of ECU to the disconnected valve. Only the tube to the actuator was reconnected to the new valve.
I have a reason to blow so much: i'm selling her now and than more than better))))

I've decided to try to install gtech1.

One question not by the thread: how bad my english is?)))))

So you still have 2 of the 3 original hoses connected to the original EBV?

I think you'd need to have the 2 lower hoses (high pressure side of turbo + wastegate actuator) disconnected from the original EBV and connected to the new valve for the boost controller to work correctly.

You can leave the electrical connector + the top hose on the original EBV, the ECU is OK with it like that.

Your English is OK.

Original EBV has three hoses: before turbo, after turbo, actuator. Now actuator hose is closed so ECU is ruling the boost to the nothing)))) Valve mix two pressures (before and after turbo) to make ruling pressure for actuator.
Gizzmo EBV uses the same two pressures but it takes high pressure directly from inlet manifold (connected to the hose of fuel pressure regulator by the connections of pressure gauge and EBC) and takes low pressure from the atmosphere. Valve's out is connected to the actuator.

Thanks! Alfa Romeo made me not only good knowing in vehicle principles and construction but in english as well)))

I've "-" disconnected. We'll see...)))))

Nothing...

Correcting of power box's maps and decreasing of boost to 1.45 bar didn't help(((((
On monday or tuesday I get to go to the diagnostics.

Can something in gas distribution mechanism call the knocking while AFR is good?

On that monday morning I had catched up PT Cruiser's back)))))
Exactly as I was watching for gauges to find boost and revs of fuel cut. It seemed to be 0.7 bar but I'm not sure.
I'll try to disconnect box, decrease boost to 1.2 and, if it doesn't help, I'll repair the fuel pump.

Fuel cut is caused by unallowable value of adaptation.
Only once I had adaptation less than 1% on used original MAF. On Chinese - 30%. And even on current original bosch MAF I had adaptation more than 10%.

After repairing of timing belt and spark plugs fuel cut has gone)))

Hi Cujo,
You did a great job! We enjoyed your pictures and stories about the Coupé Turbo into 145D conversion ...

We, my son and I, did the same with a Coupé turbo 1998 and a 145TS 2001. Great ... it is alive now ..! We showed some pictures of this project already on this forum.
But ... we have some small electrical problems. Maybe you can help us.

We connected the Coupé speed sensor to the 145TS speedometer; the ECU works correct but the speedometer doesn't. Do we have the use the original 145TS sensor?

We did the same with the tachometer. It works ... but the values were not correct.
How did you solve this problems?

KInd Alfa-Coupé regards,
Oscar & Guido
The Netherlands

Hi!
Glad to hear it!
I'm very satisfied that I have this experience but I never want to make this f...ng swap again)))))
I didn't do the swap by my own hands so I can't tell you details((((
Speedometer takes signal from sensor on the gearbox or from ABS - I don't remember. And the man who did it - as well)))))) But he prefer to use ABS system to get speed value. I have big mistake: 120 on dashboard is equal 108 on GPS.
RPM increases value due to five cylinders instead of original four. I had try to make electric scheme to transform the signal but it didn't work well, and now I just remember 3000 = 2340 and 4000 is little more than 3000 (value from fiat examiner). It's really cool when you can put the arrow down and go forward))))) and turbo starts to blow hard correct on dashboard's 4000 (vertical position).

Did you read my thread on 145 forum?)

Some new videos:
http://youtu.be/DMxsK9TdajI
http://youtu.be/qDFkhir4lfI
http://youtu.be/AGUcbROiSgk

Now I have Gizzmo EBC instead on original overboost valve but original valve is connected to provide ECU working without surprises))))
And I met interesting thing: ECU has WOT maps that, I guess, doesn't use MAF signal. It causes strange effect: with a half opened throttle I have better dynamic than with full.
With a half - it let reach 1.8 bar with 10-11 AFR.
With full - 1.2-1.4 bar with 12.5-13 AFR.

Looks like the Alfa finally got the right engine . Enjoy the ride

Thanks!))))

Hi Cujo,
Yeah, it really is a once in a life time challenge.
So you have similar problems with the calibration of the instruments. I will try to find a solution for this, I'll let you know then ...

Yes we did read your blues story, with pictures, on the Alfa 145 forum. Great!

Our 145 Coupe had his first ride last week. It drives great and have enough power. The turbo is soon redhot, is that a problem?

Regards Oscar & Guido