Its a fair point to say these non turbos will never fetch any where near some of the more sought after models.

I'm a bit of a geek with pricing and even though its impossible to know the prices after all the ups and downs value of these cars (and the spares).

I would say that if they ever become collectable to a wider audience all the models will have a steady to strong price. Cars like these that are often overlooked can easily go either way.

As I say above the more desirable models will always fetch a much stronger price but if they ever do have a peak time the top notch ones can take a very long time to sell due to the variety and choice.

Even if you are looking right now you will check the condition, history, performance figures, aftermarket parts, originality, trinkets, mileage etc.

If you've modded your car and original parts are rare or over priced you may well get a good price in time. I think an original condition will always be a first choice but a new buyer wont be able to resist looking at the modified cars to weigh up their options.

If you have a non turbo you may only get a percentage of a turbo price but if its in good condition and your asking a fair price I'll bet you a bottle of single malt you wont have to wait very long to sell it.

I feel a very long list of everyone's favourite tipples being messaged to me now

Yep Oban for me. Failing that, Penderyn Port barrel aged.

In time for Christmas please mate !!

Anyway an interesting question this. I would have thought that as they become collectable, it will be condition rather than model which be the biggest factor. It is not always the latest and "best" models that become classics. Look at MGBs where the older chrome bumpers sell better than later ones. Same with split screen VWs. There might even be a premium for the niche market of the 16v "grale" engine coupes !! Since they will be as rare as rocking horse dung.

I suspect that the 20v will remain the coupe of choice though, simply because of the publicity.

Either way, i imagine it will be 10+ years before prices rise.

Hi Gripped

Yeh Im more Oliver Twist than Father Christmas!!

It was a 5 to 10 year punt I was looking at when I purchased early this year. Ive bumped into my other choice of cars I had in mind and confident I picked the best of the bunch.

Without sounding like a grumpy old man the only time any classics get any wide spread knowledge are when they're at the end of the scales because you get the comments in the 3 stages.

Stage 1 peak comments:- Ive been looking at these, cant believe how much they're worth nowadays.

Stage 2 crash comments:- Theyre not worth anything them are they, did you know how much they were fetching back in 1839.

Stage 3 recovery comment:- No comments, just a good old natter with a fellow car lover

I'd agree condition will be everything......but predict turbos and 16v's will be first to rise due to the performance / rarity.

That's exactly what has happened with my other car, a Porsche 944.... for many years they have just been old sports cars, however the past few years has seen excellent examples of the Turbo more than double in value, a trend closely followed by the early square dash models due to their rapidly dwindling numbers.

Only the very best most original early models are increasing - condition and originality being the key drivers. The turbos again are condition driven but sympathetically modified cars are also in demand.

The oldest early cars are now 32 years old....and the youngest are at least 22. years old......so I guess I would be looking at another 15 years before my 16v is considered worthy of a good return on my investment.

I suspect that after eighteen years, I've already had the good return on my investment...

Im currently restoring both a scotts green 20vt for myself and a porto 20v for my wife. My turbo is modified but i am keeping my wifes as original as possible.

You are definately one of the few that has actually profited from buying a new car Neil, I normally suffer the massive depreciation loss every three years or so when the car gets upgraded

Never owned a car that gave so many smiles per gallon! Outright performance aside the N / A sounds better and is as most report the more reliable of the models. It may take a few years before values start to climb but they will and I intend to keep mine a good few years yet.
Now back to my buzzing sunroof.....

I am in the annoying position of having too many old vehicles cluttering up the drive, and the while the Fiat is very practical for a Coupe, the other cars (both diesel) win the "sensible" competition..... so working out how to keep the Coop...... May even SORN it and try and squeeze into the garage.

My poor old motorbike is also jealous, as when ever I look at which keys to take, it's always the Coupe...

Now you know

I'm very happy with my N/A.

In fact I could have bought a couple of 'natty' VT's for the money I spent on it- but turbo engines have a harder life- thermally and compression wise. I'm in in this for the LONG haul.

I can live without 0-60 in 6.3 (or whatever it is) lovely as that is and you can't deny the performance of those cars is astonishing- been there before myself. But I can also live without the added engine management complexity (indeed I was professionally advised to do so) and so deliberately opted out.

That's my twopence worth!

JimP

JimP, the sentence you were looking for was "I'm a big wuss".

Haha

We'll ignore the fact that 'big wuss' cars like mine have been quicker around both Spa and Curborough than some 20VTs...

I'm in the enviable position of having either owned or driven for significant distances all engine versions. And I have always kept the 16V NA and sold the others.

The 20VT is an excellent long distance tourer - it's a classic GT. But the lighter front-axle weight and lower centre of gravity of a basic 16V makes it a much better car simply for driving in the twisties.

That has to be one of big complaints with the 20vt. It feels as if you're captaining it. A few years back I was able to drive a wide track mk1 Bravo with a 1400. It had no guts about but the balance of chassis was lovely. It actually felt agile.

Yeah- I think I'd agree with that; from memory- although 'setup' must have alot to do with it. I recall (when I had the 20VT) that my Marea 20V which I had at the same time felt like the more balanced car- there was certainly better feedback from the chassis.
I was more confident in it without a doubt.

one4seven- "yeah your right, mate- I'm all wuss..."

Must admit I agree with szkom, she does feel like a bit of a barge sometimes. If it wasn't for the warble and the whoosh I'd have a 16v or a VIS.

My old 16V NA sounded great under load

Don't tempt me...

16 NAs have a great sound as you open them up; they just spin up like a jet engine... I love the sound of mine wide open

I find driving a 20 NA a bit confusing; the extra engine pulse per rev makes me think I'm over-revving all the time and I keep reaching for the gear stick.

I've got a 20V n/a and a VIS now. Haven't driven either enough to know just how much better they may be yet! Having driven the 20V n/a for a little while, i did think that the gear knob position was great and it seemed nice and smooth to drive. The 5th gear ratio was very annoying on the motorway though.

I'm going to ask this here whilst we're on high reving 5th gears-

(I know it's a bit off topic)

do people change their gearbox oil, here at all?

The Lampredi lump with a K+N cone and Flea's chip and a Supersprint rear box is turbine-smooth with an incredible howl and intoxicating rasp on pick-up with delightful spitbacks on the over-run. Smiles per mile nowt comes close even after 6 1/2 years

If I can keep my vis coupe for 10 years I will be really happy. Think I'd better clean and wax it tomorrow!

With you on that, Annie...

After getting my copy of Practical Classics yesterday, I think I'll have to keep my VIS too.



Anyway, back on topic. If non turbo's are worthless, why are all us NA owners buying them?? After all, WE are the buyers at the moment, so it stands to reason that in the future there will be people who don't want a Turbo (or can't afford the upkeep) for the same reasons we don't.

The Coupe is about more than the engine. It's the design, the rarity, the Italian flair.... but having said that, all the engines have character and make a good noise.

Good turbo cars will be rare. Simply because many have been over modded, crashed or not looked after. So a good turbo will fetch big money. But the rest of the buyers will look at NA's to own a cost effective machine.

I still miss my non VIS HGT, great noise, smooth and lovely throttle response. It's the only car that I can honestly say I should have kept!

Yeah, I remember the HGT back in 1998. A neighbour had one, and it sounded great. Navy blue it was.

Probably the wrong thread to introduce myself, but our Coupe (it is officially my wife's and she drives it the most) was bought new back in 1997, and is a N/A - we considered the turbo and thought it was not worth it for the trip to Tescos. I try to look after it, it has 80k on the clock and I am in the process of replacing some "soft" components (ie suspension), and it is about to have its belts and pumps replaced - Alternative Autos will be retiring on my spend soon :-).

As to value - it is a great car, draws admiring glances, and I reckon we have had our money's worth over its life - and we are not planning on getting rid of it. Will it be worth anything in 10/20/30 years - who knows. And frankly, who cares - I will continue to look after it because it is worth it to me and my wife, with no speculation involved.

Cheers all

Marc

Only had my 16v for 3 years, cost me 650, fsh, 80,000 miles on the clock.Now has done 109,000 , does 50 miles every day, only once not started and most things purchased for it have been cosmetic or wear and tear items. Total bargain.
Of course i could have gone down fiat and bought a fiat 500 on monthly terms and that would have cost over 3,500 quid in repayments over 3 years! [ if not more ]. Mmmm, now which one would i prefer !!!