Cameron Tax Evasion

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Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569283 11/04/2016 20:33 11/04/2016 20:33
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 754 The South of the West JonH Enjoying the ride
JonH Enjoying the ride Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 754 The South of the West	Such short memories and such vicious stirring once again by the gutter press. Anything to make a paper sell. David C the Tory Millionaire, Me, You........ and of course not forgetting Anthony Blair the Socialist(?) Multi-Millionaire - we are all as guilty/innocent on using the system to the full. And if their should be an outcry against anyone then it should be an outcry against the designers of 'the system' that is being taken advantage of to the max. (as an aside - the welfare state designers are equally as guilty for the crap systems that have been in place on that scheme from its inception). And perhaps the 'dimwit newspaper readers' should look at older historical revelations of fact before raising their voices against the current flavour of the week as a solitary incident. No.199

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569354 12/04/2016 09:52 12/04/2016 09:52
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 5,294 Portsmouth A ali_hire Forum is my life
ali_hire Forum is my life A Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 5,294 Portsmouth	Yes, it seems that Mr Caneron has done nothing wrong but the damage is done with the headlines. Most people won't read past them. What strikes me as odd is if there is no financial gain to be had by putting your money several thousand miles away then why do it? However legal or normal these schemes might be, I think the anger is more because these type of things are available to the wealthy and not the rest of us. If you have a huge salary or a few hundred thousand to invest then it seems there are plenty of ways to limit your tax bill. If you earn an average salary you don't have these options. Click here to donate to Ickle Pickles

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569375 12/04/2016 14:04 12/04/2016 14:04
B Big_Muzzie Unregistered
Big_Muzzie Unregistered B	You do have these options, just try convincing your boss to pay into an overseas account instead, you'd need to be self employed too, and the savings would have to offset costs.... the mash view

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569376 12/04/2016 14:15 12/04/2016 14:15
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty J Jim_Clennell Forum veteran
Jim_Clennell Forum veteran J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty	Like the Mash article. Here's the unsurprising news from Nigel Farage.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569378 12/04/2016 14:25 12/04/2016 14:25
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 17,367 Staffordshire Nigel Forum veteran
Nigel Forum veteran Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 17,367 Staffordshire	Offshore investments are commonplace in financial planning - most big insurance companies operate an international division, offering offshore investment products, such as investment bonds They tend to be for the type of client that already has onshore products such as ISAs, unit trusts and bonds, but they certainly aren't the sole preserve of the "wealthy"

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569384 12/04/2016 14:41 12/04/2016 14:41
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,244 Watford, Herts. H Hyperlink Forum is my life
Hyperlink Forum is my life H Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,244 Watford, Herts.	Its a way of spreading risk isn't it?

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569410 12/04/2016 19:01 12/04/2016 19:01
B Big_Muzzie Unregistered
Big_Muzzie Unregistered B	Yes, as that what insurance is - its spreading the risk. Pretty bored of the media and some of the great unwashed and their comments now, lots of them feel like bitter, nasty comments created by jealousy - can you imagine if the world was a less material place? What would people cry and moan about then?

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: ] #1569414 12/04/2016 19:28 12/04/2016 19:28
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty J Jim_Clennell Forum veteran
Jim_Clennell Forum veteran J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty	Originally Posted By: Big_Muzzie Pretty bored of the media and some of the great unwashed and their comments now, lots of them feel like bitter, nasty comments created by jealousy - can you imagine if the world was a less material place? What would people cry and moan about then? I know; those pesky low-achievers!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569422 12/04/2016 19:37 12/04/2016 19:37
B Big_Muzzie Unregistered
Big_Muzzie Unregistered B	Didn't mean it like that, hell I wish I HAD a tax bill that was big enough to warrant dodging.... But I don't blame people that can dodge for doing so, as long as it's legit! Everyone has been paid cash in hand, or paid cash in hand at somepoint it's what keeps the world turning!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569430 12/04/2016 20:31 12/04/2016 20:31
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty J Jim_Clennell Forum veteran
Jim_Clennell Forum veteran J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty	I know, I was pulling your wire!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569432 12/04/2016 20:33 12/04/2016 20:33
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,927 The Faringdon Folly O oxfordSteve Forum is my job
oxfordSteve Forum is my job O Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,927 The Faringdon Folly	I think much of the problem with Cameron is that he promised to publish his tax returns back in (I think it was) 2012, and failed to do so. He then kept schtum until the Panama connection to his fathers wheeze, which was then follow3d by a different story every day for a week til we got somewhere near the truth. As for whether it's legal or not.....I seem to remember all the expenses scandal mostly being within the letter of the rules, but absolutely stank, I view all this being pretty much the same.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: Jim_Clennell] #1569441 12/04/2016 22:50 12/04/2016 22:50
B Big_Muzzie Unregistered
Big_Muzzie Unregistered B	Originally Posted By: Jim_Clennell I know, I was pulling your wire! Phew, thank God the wire wasn't connected to any thing volatile.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569449 12/04/2016 23:29 12/04/2016 23:29
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon H_R My life on the forum
H_R My life on the forum Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon	Agree with Oxford Steve! just because its in the rules doesnt mean its ok When you have somebody making decisions about what to cut, its a bit shallow cutting the people in need and giving tax breaks to the rich! Cameron has not exactly been straight regarding doing everything in his power to stop tax evasion! And if its so ok and Morally acceptable to evade tax why was he so Coy about his previous tax affairs? Also its quite telling that he got rid of the dodgy shares before he became Prime minister just goes to show that was bagage he did not want to have as a Prime minister! Nothing wrong with evading tax within the law but why is it right for a business or an individual to be earning millions/billions and not contributing to the society that they make their money from! If they take their money from us they should pay a proper proportion of it into the tax system to benefit the same individuals that help them to make their money!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: H_R] #1569458 13/04/2016 08:50 13/04/2016 08:50
N n3dsd Unregistered
n3dsd Unregistered N	Originally Posted By: H_R Agree with Oxford Steve! just because its in the rules doesnt mean its ok When you have somebody making decisions about what to cut, its a bit shallow cutting the people in need and giving tax breaks to the rich! Cameron has not exactly been straight regarding doing everything in his power to stop tax evasion! And if its so ok and Morally acceptable to evade tax why was he so Coy about his previous tax affairs? Also its quite telling that he got rid of the dodgy shares before he became Prime minister just goes to show that was bagage he did not want to have as a Prime minister! Nothing wrong with evading tax within the law but why is it right for a business or an individual to be earning millions/billions and not contributing to the society that they make their money from! If they take their money from us they should pay a proper proportion of it into the tax system to benefit the same individuals that help them to make their money! I take it you have not read ..or understood, the previous posts. What Cameron had was NOT illegal or EVASION , it was a way of ordering your affairs ,quite legally and done by many ordinary people. Also the shares were quite legitimate. If you what to rail about something try Amazon or Paypal and Starbucks ,they are the ones who are abusing the system ...legally. All you are doing is believing the headlines!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569459 13/04/2016 09:13 13/04/2016 09:13
Joined: Dec 2008 Posts: 826 Kent C cyborg7 Club member 1400
cyborg7 Club member 1400 Enjoying the ride C Joined: Dec 2008 Posts: 826 Kent	I don't pretend to understand how the off-shore fund that Cameron Snr set up minimised tax liability. But clearly that was the intention. Completely accept this was legal avoidance and not illegal evasion. So what's the difference between the Cameron Snr fund and Google/ Amazon et al. While I don't think anyone is saying any law has been broken its the accusation of hypocrisy by Cameron Jnr criticising others that I'm struggling to know is a valid or not. How is off-shoring the fund any different than multi-national off-setting profit. I don't buy the 'it attracts more foreign investment' argument. Last edited by cyborg7; 13/04/2016 09:22. https://lancia1965.wordpress.com

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569460 13/04/2016 09:37 13/04/2016 09:37
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 12,643 Watford MarioCirillo OP Ex El Presidente
MarioCirillo OP Ex El Presidente I AM a Coop Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 12,643 Watford	It doesn't even have anything to do with tax evasion. Its just comical. It was an INVESTMENT. He brought shares...very small....negligible amount. When he sold them he paid capital gains. He has some cash and wanted to gamble it to try and make more. No different to those who dabble on thenstock market. Or those who bet down at the casino (although those lucky ones wont pay tax on winnings) I find the whole thing hillarious. I cant believe people are picketing for him to stand down. At least it gives the same old tree hugging protestors something to keep them busy for a while. The argument is so weak now that its gone from tax evasion to "oh oh he lied to us" Well im sorry if someone was slagging off my dead dad i dont think i would have been too forthcoming either. - rant over Proud Owner of Rosso Speed LE041

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569461 13/04/2016 09:37 13/04/2016 09:37
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon H_R My life on the forum
H_R My life on the forum Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon	n3dsd you jumped the gun there mate First paragraph states I'm aware it's not illegal! Was just trying to say if the companies/individuals earn their money from the UK then it's morally correct that they pay the proper amount of tax without avoidance/planning schemes! I'm aware we all try to get a deal save money "knock the vat off for cash mate" But we are talking about "in general" companies that pay the absolute minimum avoid paying all sorts of stuff treat there staff like dirt and hide millions in avoidance schemes! Obviously some companies look after there staff but still avoid! Was just highlighting the worst end of the stick If they earn from us they should pay their fair share to our society!!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569470 13/04/2016 10:47 13/04/2016 10:47
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,302 Pontefract, West Yorkshire andyps My job on the forum
andyps My job on the forum Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,302 Pontefract, West Yorkshire	Quite amusing that Labour are now calling for Cameron to declare his tax affairs from before he was PM yet Corbyn didn't even have a record of his last return without asking HMRC for it. I don't think there would be any obligation for Cameron to still have records that far back anyway. As for Corbyn, at least he did the good socialist thing and paid more tax than he had to by submitting his return over 3 months late. But I'm pretty sure the £500 for use of shared office he claimed was a way to reduce his tax liability, or in other words, tax avoidance. As no doubt is the lack of any declared interest on savings, use of an ISA? Andy

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: andyps] #1569487 13/04/2016 13:23 13/04/2016 13:23
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 17,367 Staffordshire Nigel Forum veteran
Nigel Forum veteran Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 17,367 Staffordshire	Originally Posted By: andyps As for Corbyn, at least he did the good socialist thing and paid more tax than he had to by submitting his return over 3 months late. It was only five days late (MP's are given an extra three months to submit returns) However, it now seems that his return was factually and materially incorrect, as he omitted to detail his State Pension - I believe that could be regarded as attempted tax evasion - oh, the irony.... EDIT - unless he deferred his State Pension of course, which would be a valid reason for not declaring it... EDIT AGAIN - seems he is in receipt of State Pension (plus another smaller pension) but "forgot" to enter it on his tax return. You really couldn't write this.... Last edited by Nigel; 13/04/2016 14:22. Reason: Comedy gold....

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569492 13/04/2016 14:38 13/04/2016 14:38
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty J Jim_Clennell Forum veteran
Jim_Clennell Forum veteran J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 16,603 Corridor of Uncertainty	It's the exact same syndrome as correcting someone's grammar in a post on a forum. You can be sure you will have made an equally heinous blunder, thus undermining your own smart-arsed indignation. The lesson in all this SHOULD be that instead of cheap political point-scoring, the government should be doing a better job of governing and the opposition should be doing a better job of opposing.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569493 13/04/2016 15:12 13/04/2016 15:12
B Big_Muzzie Unregistered
Big_Muzzie Unregistered B	Nail on head Jim!

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: H_R] #1569494 13/04/2016 15:27 13/04/2016 15:27
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 611 Aberdeenshire,Scotland A Azzura Enjoying the ride
Azzura Enjoying the ride A Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 611 Aberdeenshire,Scotland	Originally Posted By: H_R n3dsd you jumped the gun there mate First paragraph states I'm aware it's not illegal! No, he didn't jump the gun. Tax EVASION is illegal, tax AVOIDANCE is not. You referred to tax evasion as if it were what Cameron has done and also as if it were legal. Evasion means a false pretence about what you earn so that you do not attract tax, avoidance means truly declaring your earnings but using legal structures , allowances and expenses to offset the amount of tax. Yesterday Sprint Blue 20VT,today Denim Blue TT225

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569495 13/04/2016 15:36 13/04/2016 15:36
Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,927 The Faringdon Folly O oxfordSteve Forum is my job
oxfordSteve Forum is my job O Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,927 The Faringdon Folly	The line between avoidance and evasion is pretty damned blurry though, which is why accountancy firms make a very good living out of it. It doesn't alter the fact that, while holding shares in an offshore unit trust, Cameron lobbied to have such things to be made except from the proposed EU regs on beneficial ownership declaration.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: Azzura] #1569507 13/04/2016 17:18 13/04/2016 17:18
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon H_R My life on the forum
H_R My life on the forum Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon	Originally Posted By: Azzura Originally Posted By: H_R n3dsd you jumped the gun there mate First paragraph states I'm aware it's not illegal! No, he didn't jump the gun. Tax EVASION is illegal, tax AVOIDANCE is not. You referred to tax evasion as if it were what Cameron has done and also as if it were legal. Evasion means a false pretence about what you earn so that you do not attract tax, avoidance means truly declaring your earnings but using legal structures , allowances and expenses to offset the amount of tax. Your splitting at hairs Azzurra the choice of word may of been wrong but if you read it all you would of got the jist

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569513 13/04/2016 18:21 13/04/2016 18:21
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,244 Watford, Herts. H Hyperlink Forum is my life
Hyperlink Forum is my life H Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,244 Watford, Herts.	Its an important hair to split though with so many people conflating the two and using them interchangeably.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: MarioCirillo] #1569514 13/04/2016 18:33 13/04/2016 18:33
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 611 Aberdeenshire,Scotland A Azzura Enjoying the ride
Azzura Enjoying the ride A Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 611 Aberdeenshire,Scotland	It really is NOT splitting hairs. Two entirely different words with very different meanings. Think "paediatrician" and "paedophile", or "mother child" and "smother child" , am I splitting hairs if I insist on the correct choice of words when talking about these sort of things? Yesterday Sprint Blue 20VT,today Denim Blue TT225

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: Azzura] #1569517 13/04/2016 18:55 13/04/2016 18:55
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 7,704 Harpenden S sugerbear Je suis un Coupé
sugerbear Je suis un Coupé S Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 7,704 Harpenden	Originally Posted By: Azzura Originally Posted By: H_R n3dsd you jumped the gun there mate First paragraph states I'm aware it's not illegal! No, he didn't jump the gun. Tax EVASION is illegal, tax AVOIDANCE is not. You referred to tax evasion as if it were what Cameron has done and also as if it were legal. Evasion means a false pretence about what you earn so that you do not attract tax, avoidance means truly declaring your earnings but using legal structures , allowances and expenses to offset the amount of tax. 2015 tory manifesto. Crack down on (aggressive) tax avoidance. It's there, all written down. The Tories responding to schemes like K2, criticising Starbucks, Apple, Amazon etc but then quite happy to have done much the same avoidance themselves. You could argue that a fund that is administered from the UK and is setup in a tax free jurisdiction is aggressive. It's being done with the primary motive of avoiding UK tax (most likely corporation / dividend tax) and regulation. How to make a startrek widget cable >> http://tinyurl.com/dyje6fy

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: Nigel] #1569519 13/04/2016 18:56 13/04/2016 18:56
J Jonny Unregistered
Jonny Unregistered J	Originally Posted By: Nigel Originally Posted By: andyps As for Corbyn, at least he did the good socialist thing and paid more tax than he had to by submitting his return over 3 months late. It was only five days late (MP's are given an extra three months to submit returns) However, it now seems that his return was factually and materially incorrect, as he omitted to detail his State Pension - I believe that could be regarded as attempted tax evasion - oh, the irony.... EDIT - unless he deferred his State Pension of course, which would be a valid reason for not declaring it... EDIT AGAIN - seems he is in receipt of State Pension (plus another smaller pension) but "forgot" to enter it on his tax return. You really couldn't write this.... Fantastic, you've made my day He needs to get that revised return in quickly to avoid paying penalties

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: oxfordSteve] #1569524 13/04/2016 19:05 13/04/2016 19:05
J Jonny Unregistered
Jonny Unregistered J	Originally Posted By: oxfordSteve The line between avoidance and evasion is pretty damned blurry though, which is why accountancy firms make a very good living out of it. It isn't I promise. For a competent accountant it's very easy to see the difference. Tax avoidance involves advising HMRC of the scheme you are using and asking them to review your return if they wish. It is all open and transparent and has been for many many years. Tax evasion is something entirely different- under-declaring income etc on purpose.

Re: Cameron Tax Evasion [Re: Azzura] #1569527 13/04/2016 19:16 13/04/2016 19:16
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon H_R My life on the forum
H_R My life on the forum Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,650 Dark side of the Moon	Originally Posted By: Azzura It really is NOT splitting hairs. Two entirely different words with very different meanings. Think "paediatrician" and "paedophile", or "mother child" and "smother child" , am I splitting hairs if I insist on the correct choice of words when talking about these sort of things? Yes really! because you are implying I "meant" the wrong word where in fact I used the wrong word, as already stated! If you read what I actually said you would understand! not worth getting your knickers in a twist over! Enough said back to the topic please!

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