I must admit that I don't understand people's comments when they say it seems laggier - maybe the stupid temps here means it makes back any increase in induction length with much lower charge temps ?

Yes I am using the straight induction pipe too, dont think it makes all that much difference to be honest. Im not complaining about the FMIC, its just my observations on how the car drives with it fitted, its totally different from the chargecooled coupe I used to own, in some ways better, in some ways worse !

I`ve got Straight ind.pipe, FMIC, and I`ve kept the chargecooler on as well,in which way do you find it `different` with one or the other Jimbo ?

I'll keep you posted. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Paul,

The car has lost most of its low down punch and throttle response, where it used to be squeze the pedal and the car would respond instantly its now a case of squeze the pedal and wait for the car to respond.
Above 3500-4000rpm its pulls nicely but still with a delay in throttle response.

Im sure a power plot on the rollers will show up the difference in delivery.
Im still getting 1 bar at 2500rpm as I used to but its just the throttle response thats gone <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Is this because you went from the pace SMIC? Would you expect a loss of throttle response going from a standard SMIC and K&N to the FMIC and SI?

Yes Trappy, you have almost doubled the length of the induction pipework so the air has much further to travel and the turbo has a larger area to pressurise before it reaches the throttle.

thats obviously more the FMIC than the chargecooler,I certainly have lost a few rpm to lag,but I put that more down to the GT28r,than the FMIC,but,yes as you say ,the extra pipe length will add to it too.
I don`t get 1 bar until approx 2900, but by 3100 we are really beginning to get a good shove in the back,maybe thats down to the fact,I reckon I have a rather large torque figure,with the head/valve work,chargcooler,aquamist etc etc,I still get the sensation of squeeze the throttle....................and we are off <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm assuming its the intercooler to engine pipework that's longer, right? Surely the fact that the SI is shorter than the original intake you don't increase the length overall? The original intake to turbo must be 2 1/2' long?

I'd put it more down to the extra area to pressurise than the extra length to travel... <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

If you think about it, the SI pipe isnt really that much shorter, you probably save yourself about 3" of pipe but thats not what causes lag, its the post turbo pipe work thats easily double the standard routing that will cause lag.

Maybe its just time for me to invest in a larger turbo, if Im going to suffer from lag then I may as well make up for it at the top end with a better blower <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I haven't seen a FMIC with SI yet (and tbh i haven't really had a proper look at the exhisting bits) but the SI consists of a 1 foot metal pipe with fitments either end, right?

I imagined it was a lot shorter than the original induction pipe that runs from the bottom front of the engine bay, to near enough the bonnet hinges and not even in a straight line! I'll have a butchers at mine tonight.

Anyone got a link to the cut-through-coupe picture? I've looked for it a few times but can never find it. Saying that i bet that was a 16vT now... <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Jimbo, the SI surely saves a lot more than 3",it does`nt go all the way up to where the air box sat,also it (as the name says) is straight,no twisty and turny bits like the standard out the air box standard fair

When I first fitted an FMIC on the coupe I measured my inlet and it was shorter than stock. I've not seen the Pro alloy kit but the run SHOULD be shorter.

The lagginess is also a property of the core of the intercooler and I have no idea how good the pro-alloy one is. Like I said before I can offer a genuine Evo 9 intercooler to be used to do a comparison of power on a dyno if anyone wants to do it.
John

I wasnt running the airbox Paul but the 45' hose from the AMS, laying the SI pipe and attachment pipes out next to the standard run of pipes and it wasnt much differencein length between the turbo inlet end and the AMS, you obviously save quite a lot after that if you've removed the airbox.

John, I think from what I could see of the PA intercooler its a tube and fin design, its plenty big enough to not be restrictive so it might just be my set up of the superspool that it doesnt suit.
I'll get it on the rollers to see whats happening but I just find it strange that this FMIC has been raved about for quite some time now but Im the only one who finds it increased lag and loses low down torque ?

<img src="/forum/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Barbz was going to try the superspool on mine, but felt due to the BIG fmic it may not have the grunt I wanted,so i`m guessing that may indeed be your problem.
BTW did you get my pm ?

I did Paul and I wrote you a nice long PM in reply but you inbox is full <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Yes I think its time for a new blower, should I start a thread on whats better, the GT28R or GT28RS <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

curious now into what it will react like with my gtir hybrid??

i aint driven the coop for a month so compared to my micra it will be a supercar no matter what!! lol

I`m about to change my GT28R.are we ever happy !!(for more than 10 mins !! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ),apologies I will check my pm box <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

It works fine with mine Gareth <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />. Personally I felt that it was beneficial even with a standard turbo, but the switch to a GTiR certainly made a big difference <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />!

Phil

Just what i want to hear <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Nice new siggy pic there BTW highwayman, shame thats not with the new bumper <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

This is what I dont understand Phil, how come people feel the benefit with a standard turbo and yet Im getting more lag and less throttle response with a superspool <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Its not like you cant fit the thing correctly, its a few pipes and a big alloy radiator. Maybe the car needs time to adjust ?

That's a good point actually - would an ECU reset help, as you've changed the induction length ?

I'm still running on the standard turbo and I noticed a definite improvement. Stating the obvious but definitely worth checking the clips for boost leaks. Also the metal on the piping in/out of the i/c itself is prone to deformation as it's quite soft and therefore more chance of boost leak there.

i feel the same as you Jimbo with FMIC & STD Turbo, however i have feeling that this all will be disappeared once i fit the SIP. (I hope)

Well I've just fitted mine tonight, the quality is superb. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/love.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Fits together very easily and looks great behind my Zender. I didn't get the chance to take her out for a spin, but I will tomorrow hopefully.

A big thanks to Phil and Wayne. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

more big NA feel to the car , with the FMIC/TB28 combo.

fun.

Has anyone fitted the SIP yet and used any shields to protect the filter from water?

I angled my filter up slightly using some spare 45' Samco hose I had knocking around, keeps it slightly raised and out of harms way.

To further my above comments, I had a look at my apexi boost controller on a long drive yesterday, I wasnt reaching my required boost level until 5000rpm so I had to increase the gain at lower revs to reach the boost level required.
This has got me thinking that the superspool is too small to use with the FMIC and its struggling to pressurise the system at low revs and low exhaust gas speed but working ok when the revs are higher with more exhaust gasses to keep the turbo going.

This is a real shame, I wanted to make a very driveable car with lots of mid range grunt, I wasnt all that bothered about big bhp figures and not so much low down power.

Im now a little stuck, do I either take the PA FMIC off and go back to the chargecooler with its much better delivery of power or do I go for a different turbo ?

It seems the more I try to improve the car the further away I get from my goal <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Interesting quandry Jimbo as i have a Pace FMIC and one of Barbz Induction pipes mated to a hybrid T28 with a modded head and a soon to be fitted bigger downpipe. I would reckon that the only other mod would be the single pass FMIC but after hearing you maybe the chargecooler is an option. Not sure though, i don't know enough about this yet.

Any suggestioons??

I STILL don't understand this Jimbo - my standard tubby and the PA FMIC got on like lager and curry.

Boost came in well before 3k and hit hard, it didn't really run out of puff until 6k or so and generally felt like the car had had a furball in its throat before fitting.

Something tells me there's more to this than meets the eye.