I know this has been spoke about alot, but I am going to ask again,

What are the Best Springs for Standard shock ?
Do the 16vt Eibach fit the 20vt shocks ?
If they do fit do the give a better ride?

I would like to lower it about 30mm but dont want to wreck the ride to much as it rides pretty hard with 18s I got on crappy roads.

Thanks all in advance for your advise <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

i think the best compromise between ride confort, safety and handling is bilstein+eibach springs...

but I do have the same question...I've heard of some people using eibach + standard shocks, not sure if that'll be safe (since the shocks will alway be compressed) or confortable

Anyone know the answers to my questions ? <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Cheers

the springs are the same...just not calibrated the same way since the car's weight is not the same

if you want feedback on different setups go to the faq section, all the answers you need are there

Personally i wouldn't lower it without uprated shocks. You can get Koni yellow inserts pretty cheap really so its worth doing, would improve the ride comfort no end over lowering springs and standard shocks!

the main problem with lowering with standard shocks wouldn't be ride confort but safety..the shocks will be compress (probably fully) all the time and won't work as they should

Nice one cheers for your help guys <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Thats not correct. Have you ever compresed a shock by hand off the car? it dosent spring back to a set position, it sits happily at any point, all a shock does is control the rate the spring bounces - without a shock (or damper), the spring would bounce the wheel like a basketball. A shock works exactly the same through its whole stroke, and should not bottom out before the car hits its bumpstops anyway so length isn't a problem.

every shock has a working height and is thought to work with a defined spring. If you reduce the spring's height by lets say 35mm you reduce the decompression possibility by 35mm. if the compression-depcompression "bandwith" is of just 35mm the shock will always be compressed. It would be the same as having an iron bar instead of the shock. The ride will be crashy and when you break there'll be no physical help from the shocks. It all dependes on the maximum compression the standard shock can support..but my advice is not to lower without using proper shocks

We'll agree to disagree, i say you wouldn't have a problem lowering the car, just like about 50% of this sites members. If uprated shocks are the same length as standard shocks, what are you supposed to do to lower your car in that case? When you talk about a shock working with a 'defined spring', its more about the compression rate than length.

The shock will have enough travel to let the suspension hit its bumpstops, so it just won't be a problem - the bumpstop will get in the way before the shock bottoms out. I have run a track car for the past two years on AVO standard length shocks lowered about 75mm from standard (not a coupe) and the shocks are just fine.

and with those shocks you have enough travel? "I'm shocked" <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
anyhow you can never compare race tracks with any other road..you drive on a flat "perfect" surface and even if your shocks aren't working as they should you probably would only notice it when braking, and that would only be very noticeble if you didn't have an over-sized braking system (but I believe you have..so that you can brake as late as possible)

if that was true why spend loads of money in research and why produce shortned shock to use with lowering springs if you could just use the oem ones? I advice him to buy new shocks also, but that's just my 2 cents

@brian, if what you were saying was true then that would mean you couldnt run standard springs with uprated shocks also, which you can. MY advice is standard shocks and eibach springs, Rog the owner of PowerFiat.co.uk does this with his own car with no ill effects to note and he has been known to give them some good testing <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> .

If you can afford some bilstiens maybe get them as people have said good things but personnally i doubt you will notice a difference, i have konis and eibachs at the moment but will be changing to standard shocks.

I wish my english wasn't so rusty...now I can't explain you why I think that you can run standard springs with uprated shocks...In a shock you have the "maximum height" and "minimum height" on an uprated shock you still have a similar "maximum height" but a lower "minimum height" (apart from compresion-decompression diferences) that's why you can use diferent lowering springs on an uprated shock, but you can still use standard ones since at the maximum "decompression" the shock will be around the same height

You're not reading what i said - the car will hit its bumpstops before the shocks bottom out, the length of the stroke is not a problem, they're designed to compress short enough. You will have less suspension travel when the car is lowered as the bumpstops are in the same place so the shocks will not bottom out. What about when you have passengers? The suspension likely sags further then 35mm on a fully laden car, and the car is designed to be safe under these conditions.

if your suspension is ok i don't believe it'll go as far as 35mm anyway the car is not as safe as at normal position, that's why some stationwagons have a self-leveling system (alfa romeo 156 for instance had this system on the back so that when you loaded the trunk the height would still be same) to improve safety levels

Why unsafe though?! Cars are made to sit so high as a practical compromise. Having a lower car just lowers the center of gravity, improving stability, and reduces the bound suspension stroke before it hits the bumpstops by however much you lower it by - although this is offset as the new springs are firmer.

I hope this isn't taken as an argument, by the way, it's just healthy discussion!

Ok so my shocks with some Eibachs would be ok <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Whats the better one to fit 16vt or 20vt ones ?

Ta all <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

They are both right Edz <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

The golden rule with (shocks is an incorrect name really) Dampners, is to not lower below 35mm.

If your dampners are old and tired new stiffer lowering spings will put more strain on them.

If you lowered your car say 60mm then you would wear out your dampners much quicker. Mainly because of the spring stiffness. This is why you have stiffer dampners to go with stiffer springs. I have lowered several non Fiats 30-35mm and never had problems with the dampners.

If your original dampners have done loads of miles then you could end up wearing them out that much quicker as they will already be weakening. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

My dampners are about 2 years old and I only want a 30mm drop <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

yes...lower centre of gravity is good but with the right equipment...that's why they use that system on the alfa 156 for instance, because the shocks (or dampers) + springs where designed to work best at a "normal" position, and not at a compreesed one

and no...it's not an argument <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Edz, is that my old coupe you have there (Vinci grey 10VT LE) from the Chelmsford area??? If so its looking pretty good. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/love.gif" alt="" />.....i still miss it tho <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/cry.gif" alt="" />

You mean dampers. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> They're called shocks as this is short for shock absorbers.

My car is on -40mm Novitec springs and 18s with standadr shocks, its fine. 'Firm', can be a little bit crashy on very poor surfaces/potholes, but quite acceptable. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Oooooooooooops. Yes dampers. My spelling sometimes <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Always got told years ago by my Motor vehicle engineering tutor that shocks (shock absorbers) could imply the whole suspension setup as that is what suspension does. hence dampers being more accurate.

Strange that has always stuck with me

<img src="/forum/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

Cool what about speed bumps dont want to drop to much so it dont hit the front bumper <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

And shock absorber is an incorrect term too, the spring is the shock absorber, the damper dampens the springs ocsilations <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Some say that the 16vt Eibachs give a better ride than the 20vt versions when used on a 20v. Is this because they are taller?

Yeah I heard that as well is this true are these the better ones to get and do they lower the car the same height ?? <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I've got 16vt eibachs with Bilsteins on my 20vt. I haven't driven a coupe with 20vt eibachs and bilsteins to compare though, so I can't say if they are really any better. But they do sit a tad higher at the front then the 20vt springs. I don't mind that much though, I reckon they will save me a few bumper lips in the long term <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

I have no problems with mine over speedbumps lowered 40mm on 18s with Zender bumper. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Its not as bad as you'd expect.