GTEC 2 RR results

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GTEC 2 RR results #27156 17/01/2006 00:49 17/01/2006 00:49
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon paddy OP Enjoying the ride
paddy OP Enjoying the ride Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon	Hi, I've got a fairly standard car - the only real engine mod is a hybrid turbo, and the GTEC 2 chip From my own perspective, the car feels more responsive of boost, and also quicker to hit full boost than with the standard chip, but the RR results are a bit disapointing. The fueling is mega rich (of the chart a lot of the time) from 4000 RPM which seems to be robbing me of some power. Having said this it's reasuring that it's not running lean, so shouldn't be doing any damage to the engine... Power @ the wheels http://ddy.fotopic.net/p24992423.html Boost: http://ddy.fotopic.net/p24992422.html Air fuel ratio: http://ddy.fotopic.net/p24992421.html Last edited by paddy; 17/01/2006 00:49.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27157 17/01/2006 01:22 17/01/2006 01:22
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 12,295 Sandhurst Begbie Ex El Presidente
Begbie Ex El Presidente I AM a Coop Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 12,295 Sandhurst	Running too rich will damage your engine, its called bore wash. This is when there is too much fuel going in, which cleans the side of the engine washing the oil away instead of leaving it there for protection. Also the GTEC 2 was meant to be for cars with a lot of mods, not a car with just a hybrid turbo, hence why your over fueling! Originally Posted by Jonny - After being taken out at Spa Your car is Usain Bolt with wellies

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27158 17/01/2006 01:47 17/01/2006 01:47
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	You should really have a Gtec1 of either 1.2 or 1.3bar setting for what you have done so far...

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27159 17/01/2006 02:17 17/01/2006 02:17
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	224bhp at the wheels? U sure? Ross

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27160 17/01/2006 02:24 17/01/2006 02:24
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Think its 224 @ fly, 181 @ wheels (as on the boost graph) @ 0.85bar

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27161 17/01/2006 02:25 17/01/2006 02:25
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon paddy OP Enjoying the ride
paddy OP Enjoying the ride Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon	224 at the fly - 181 at the wheels.... If I switch to a gtec 1 I think i'll loose the ignition advance, so it's going to make it a lot worse off boost I presume? I thought the chip should have a map acording to the amount of air going through and adjust accodingly? From what I was reading before, peoples main concerns with the GTEC 2 were charge temps and / or detonation as there is a bit of ignition advance? I'm thinking of getting a FMIC soon - should this flow more easily and get enough air through to even things out? The guy didn't think charge temps where an issue, as a second run was pretty much the same as the first, sugesting things aren't getting too hot? Last edited by paddy; 17/01/2006 02:34.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27162 17/01/2006 02:44 17/01/2006 02:44
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	The thing is as you say it reachs a certain point and the airflow meter cant read it well enough to fuel right and then just kinda goes what the hell, chuck the lot in... It then goes off the map as to how much it should chuck in for the conditions...

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27163 17/01/2006 02:47 17/01/2006 02:47
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	To be honest dude, are u running 20vt? Cause with Gtech1 and hybrid u should be guaranteed about 250bhp. So its running REALLY rich! Ross

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27164 17/01/2006 03:02 17/01/2006 03:02
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon paddy OP Enjoying the ride
paddy OP Enjoying the ride Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 928 Wimbledon	True, but would that be happening as soon as 5000 RPM, as the fueling is already pretty bad by then... I thought it tended to happen on much higher power cars and higher up in hte rev range?? May be something else is wrong - i think the best bet is to switch back to the standard chip and get another RR session done... Last edited by paddy; 17/01/2006 03:02.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27165 17/01/2006 03:03 17/01/2006 03:03
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Hyper he is running a Gtech 2 thats where his potential problem is.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27166 17/01/2006 03:04 17/01/2006 03:04
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	This is my air fuel ratio graph from Saturday at Surrey Rolling road running a hybrid at 1.1bar (red line)and at 1.2bar (blue line) with STANDARD chip. Air Fuel graph My fueling looked the sameas Paddy, (mine was the last car they did on saturday). Wonder if maybe their lambda sensor is knackered? Anyway after my readings I've now just ordered a Unichip form the group buy.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27167 17/01/2006 03:31 17/01/2006 03:31
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Kevin.... i dont think i would cause that many problems!!! But then again graham did specifically say only use optimax and only for FMIC or chargecooler runners!! Ross

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27168 17/01/2006 05:56 17/01/2006 05:56
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: My fueling looked the sameas Paddy, (mine was the last car they did on saturday). Wonder if maybe their lambda sensor is knackered? Most of the cars ran rich on the day except Yellafella's. His fuelling was perfect which sort of indicates that SRR's lambda was OK. I believe the standard chip fuels more at high revs than the GTEC. The GTEC tries to lean the AFR a bit to develop more power. Lower down the GTEC produces more fuel to support the higher boost. No idea what GTEC2 does though because as we saw on Saturday the results were all over the place. Last edited by cosmograph; 17/01/2006 05:58.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27169 17/01/2006 06:00 17/01/2006 06:00
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	On my GTECH2 it ran perfect fueling until 5.5k when it was slightly rich, but the technician was very impressed with it! Ross

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27170 17/01/2006 06:36 17/01/2006 06:36
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	I found my GTEC fuelled higher than the GTEC 2! - you should be running more power than that with a chip though - particularly with a hybrid. Any chance the RR reading was off?

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27171 17/01/2006 06:46 17/01/2006 06:46
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 9,706 Gone J Jimbo Je suis un Coupé
Jimbo Je suis un Coupé J Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 9,706 Gone	Apart from a slight overboost your only running 1.1 bar, the GTEC2 should be 1.2 to 1.3 bar and thats what it fuels for, you'd get a better result probably around 250/260bhp. Your trouble is you dont have any uprated form of charge cooling like an uprated intercooler so your in danger of causing damage if you wind the boost up to far. Fit an uprated intercooler turn the boost up and you'd be looking at 260/280bhp.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27172 17/01/2006 21:20 17/01/2006 21:20
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	what figure would be considered a good rich reading on full throttle? mine is approx 12, is that too rich hence sucking power? Last edited by ringy; 17/01/2006 21:21.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27173 17/01/2006 21:26 17/01/2006 21:26
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Ringy on a wide band lamba or in car gauge?

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27174 17/01/2006 21:26 17/01/2006 21:26
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	wideband

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27175 17/01/2006 21:31 17/01/2006 21:31
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	IIRC anywhere 11-12 is good. Under 11 = Rich Over 12.5 = lean.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27176 17/01/2006 21:33 17/01/2006 21:33
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Out of curiosity those that had problems with fuelling what do your air fuel gauges tell you when your on boost?

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27177 17/01/2006 21:36 17/01/2006 21:36
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: Kevin.... i dont think i would cause that many problems!!! But then again graham did specifically say only use optimax and only for FMIC or chargecooler runners!! Ross Yella fella im not sure what you mean? I was trying to say that his incorrect fuelling could be down to the wrong selection of chips?

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27178 17/01/2006 21:39 17/01/2006 21:39
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: Quote: Kevin.... i dont think i would cause that many problems!!! But then again graham did specifically say only use optimax and only for FMIC or chargecooler runners!! Ross Yella fella im not sure what you mean? I was trying to say that his incorrect fuelling could be down to the wrong selection of chips? Eh? Ross posted that

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27179 17/01/2006 21:48 17/01/2006 21:48
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: IIRC anywhere 11-12 is good. Under 11 = Rich Over 12.5 = lean. Ok thanks, looks like i'm on the money then.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27180 17/01/2006 21:53 17/01/2006 21:53
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	LOL too many yellow coupe owners ! I remember the days when I was in the minority sorry Hyper thats you then

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27181 17/01/2006 21:53 17/01/2006 21:53
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: 224 at the fly - 181 at the wheels.... If I switch to a gtec 1 I think i'll loose the ignition advance, so it's going to make it a lot worse off boost I presume? I thought the chip should have a map acording to the amount of air going through and adjust accodingly? From what I was reading before, peoples main concerns with the GTEC 2 were charge temps and / or detonation as there is a bit of ignition advance? I'm thinking of getting a FMIC soon - should this flow more easily and get enough air through to even things out? The guy didn't think charge temps where an issue, as a second run was pretty much the same as the first, sugesting things aren't getting too hot? Maybe switch to a Squadra chip then?

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27182 17/01/2006 21:57 17/01/2006 21:57
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	The squadra runs even richer than the gtec / gtecII (at least I remember Graham saying this on the old forum).

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27183 17/01/2006 22:02 17/01/2006 22:02
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: Out of curiosity those that had problems with fuelling what do your air fuel gauges tell you when your on boost? Kevin. Air fuel gauges arent worth a carrot. You engine will have melted before they highlight a problem. Apart from the fact the Coop narrowband sensor isnt accurate enough for open loop monitoring, the range it outputs is 0.1 to 0.9v which is incompatible with most aftermarket AFR gauges which accept inputs from 0.0v to 1.0v. In a nutshell they will just read rich all the time you have your foot down and you will never light up that last light on the gauge even with the richest air fuel ratio. Last edited by cosmograph; 17/01/2006 22:08.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27184 17/01/2006 22:04 17/01/2006 22:04
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	Quote: The squadra runs even richer than the gtec / gtecII (at least I remember Graham saying this on the old forum). Its not as simple as that. The fuelling changes over the rev range. A performance chip will often reduce fuelling at the higher rev ranges in order to create a leaner mixture which creates more power. Last edited by cosmograph; 17/01/2006 22:05.

Re: GTEC 2 RR results #27185 17/01/2006 22:08 17/01/2006 22:08
Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 5,405 Castle Combe Flea Forum is my life
Flea Forum is my life Joined: Dec 2005 Posts: 5,405 Castle Combe	The squadra is designed for a standard car hence why it dumps more fuel for cooling.

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