ok saint thanks PM sent.

Saint the info you sent me is great.
for what i understand its quite obviouse that the GT gives more power, than the T3 and more power at high revs,
still got to look at it very carefully before i buy anything

just check a few thing out.
and I have in mind 4 types of turbos.

a)T3 60trim 250bhp
b)T3/T4E, 50 trim stage II turbine +400bhp
c)T3/T4E, 60 trim stage III turbine 500bhp
d)T3/60-1, 60 trim 550bhp.

does this mean that i can get that hp with those turbos , obviously with other mods, but just cant figure out if they are direct fits. they are all 4 bolt on only that the b,c and d are 2,5" 4 bolt would it still be a direct fit ?

It's not quite as straight forward as you have said

fitting straight onto the manifold is the inlet flange, all of the turbos above are T3, the factory is T3 so they will all fit that side.

On the exhaust side the 16vt has a 5bolt outlet flange so no 4 bolt will be a straight fit

Those horsepower figures you quote are therotical maximums if everything else was up to the job. you could get a 1000bhp turbo but it will only make as much power as the rest of the engine will allow and the bigger the turbo max BHP generally (very simplistically) the slower it is to spool (more laggy) - a 1000bhp turbo would never spool on a 2l coupe as the motor is too samller to produce enough exhaust gas to drive it - ie total lag

Also the bigger the turbo the more likely you will have surge issues, this is were the motor can't use all the air the turbo is pumping and the turbo stalls

the is a heap to know about turbo sizing - your best bet is to go with something known by others, I only know a little and have been reading up for years

a) - not a bad choice for under 300bhp only slightly bigger than factory
b) - quite big for a standard motor, will likely surge at low rpm without headwork - 3500rpm to 8000rpm turbo - one I have considered
c) - bigger again and needs all bolt ons and a motor that can rev - no good under 4000rpm (will surge based on maps)
d) Marcowind has one of these on his 500bhp 4wd coupe which is near 10sec 1/4miles but the motor is race spec

AS I say see what has worked for other people and follow that

if you want over 300bhp get an integrale evo turbo - I can't remember which model (there are 2, one the same as the coupe and a bigger one - you will have to check on a grale forum) which will take you to 320bhp+ and are a known unit for the grales, think it is based on a t04b wheel

the problem is that I would have to change, pistons , rods etc...and really dont feel like doing all that hard work now, with the T3/T4E, 50 trim stage II turbine would I need to reforce the engine?

its a bit stupid having 230-240 hp and get the T3 60trim and only get to 250 if I could get to 280hp with that ill be happy

buy it in the us ! http://www.atpturbo.com ! (super60 is about 625us $ -> ~400 euro / ~305 pound ! )

but why installing a 30years old turbo when the time is going on ? gt28r should be your goal . sure , a super60 is nearly plug&play but these turbos are realy out of date ..

thats were i got most of the info form atp and very cheap too, but just wanted 280hp enough for a fornt wheel drive.
could I hit the 280 hp with the T3 60 trim ?
like I sayed in the other post dont want to take my engine apart to much head ake. what I whant is the max power posible without openning the engine.

i think you could get 280bhp with a t3super60

super 60?wich one would it be eldinho out off thees four ?
a)T3 60trim
b)T3/T4E, 50 trim stage II turbine
c)T3/T4E, 60 trim stage III turbine
d)T3/60-1, 60 trim

a, c and d are 60 trim but super ?

a)

this one should it be: http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/mercha...tegory_Code=TBN

ok noise are you 100% sure ? just before I start to order.

do I use the standard turbos wastgate on it ?

no but it should be the super60 =)

german shop : http://www.ls-cartec.de/turboladergarrett.htm

ill chek it out now

the only thing I need is the turbine and kompressor trims of the standard 16vT turbo to compare some details
thanks

well just spoke to ATP and ive been tolled to use the T3/T4E 60 trim , and no need to reforce the engine .
you can get up to 500bhp wth this turbo and withe T3 super a maximum of 350bhp . obviously with the necesary mods.
so im going to buy the T3/T4E 60 trim for 695$ and the wastgate all for 780$ not bad att all.
OPINIONS PLEASE

so has it got an external wastegate?

t3/t4 e ? to much for an original engine ..

ATP sayed that its not necesary
thats exactly what I tolled the guy over the phone and he said no need for new pistons or anything unless I whant to use over 300bhp , the difference with the super 60 is that tme maximum hp I can get form it is 350hp and form the T3/T4E up to 500bhp.
thinking of taking the T3/T4E for if in the future whant to get more than 280bhp

what do I do?

internal wastgate like original turbo

If you only want 280hp then why are you bothered about the turbo flowing up to 350hp? The T3/T4E will be significantly more laggy than the T3 super.

Well not laggy but it'll have a higher boost threshold, but you know what I mean...

ok thanks blueman .
im coonvinced now T3 super is my choice.

You have made your decision I see. IMHO the T04e-60 trim is too big and surgy for a standard 16v

Based on maps it won't work below 4500rpm at 1.2bar without being below the surge line, the T04E 60 trim would poor choice IMO, it hasn't got a very good map anyway.

well I´m having master power 810019 turbo ( 58mm compressor / 56mm turbine.48 housing. same as garrett t04e 60trim ) spools: 1 bar 3100rpm. ( tested on my friends Q4 ) no surge. standard head.

I'll throw up the compressor map shortly, but tested is better than any map so I stand corrected

Sorry - you will have to trust me this is the map and the most right is (blue) is 8000rpm, yellow is 6000rpm etc, the aqua blue is 5000rpm (1000rpm per line apart from last which is 3krpm and 2500rpm)

At 1 bar things don't look any good below 4k rpm

Based on 95% ve

T04E 60 Trim map

yep, I know. thats funny, because I have the same thing in my mind, before using the turbo. and also have read same kind of comments on the net ( map shows that surge, but on the real world it wont ) but why is it like that ? I dont know. we have used that turbo on my mates car 6kk . and how about garrett gt40 compressor with 59mm wheel ? I had that on my older car. that spools 1 bar 3800rpm and no surge. also with standard head. seems that some turbo have an extra potential, what comes to the real world surge.