is it fiats own or is it v.a.g.?

Fiat.

V.A.G.??!!!

How could you!

What a very strange question

why is it strange? dont forget ive had 2 16vts and im picking my 20vt up on wednesday! just wanted to know about it.

ive said it before and ill say it again, i have my doubts about the 20v engine ie bottom ends going etc im just hoping its down to people running silly boost and not looking after the cars as they should

The 20V engine is generally stronger than the 16V

As long as its been serviced regularly, not run low on oil and hasn't been run on high boost they are usually very reliable.

Its called lack of oil

thats what im hoping. i know how much i look after my cars so as long as the one im picking up has been looked after which im sure it has as it was benjes then it should be all dandy

Don't let Wellformed hear you ask that!

Not really strange as quite a lot of people aren`t aware of the FIAT 5-cylinder engine . Most of them just assume it to be a VAG unit (either Audi`s 5-cylinder or the VW 20valve 4-cylinder) as mentioned above or even a Volvo unit seeing as it`s had more media coverage lately with it being fitted to the Focus ST.

Baz

On a similar note. Is the 20v engine derived from another previous model. As the 16v engine is loosely based upon the lancia delta integrale engine.

Or was this engine designed from scratch for the Coupe 20v?

From scratch i think, just for the coupé

I was under the impression it came from a van engine. Possibly in the Ducato?

It was Fiat's modular design engine, first seen in 4 cylinder guise in various applications and then in 5 cylinder in the Bravo HGT before coming to the Coupe.

I'd be quite happy to have one of the Volvo 5 cylinder lumps in my coupe, they are almost bombproof.

So which other Fiats use this engine in some way or other?

I know of:

Coupe 20v
Coupe 20vt
Bravo HGT
Marea (not sure which derivation)
Stilo Abarth (2.4 version)

Any others? Vans?!

And you're getting that from where? I've known 16v engines take far more abuse and still run fine, like several integrale engines running 1.7bar mid-range boost without having issues and still on all std internals.



Loosely? You mean it is exactly the same. Pistons, rods, crank, head, valves, cams, all the same, only differences are the turbo, sump and engine mount.

Lancia Kappo?

20v and 20vt engines were developed for the Lancia Kappa AFAIK, certainly not specifically for the coupe.

correct me if im wrong but isnt the 16vt coupe engine the same parts but cheaper made? than the lancia inter?

Interesting.

Designed for this car. . Nice looking Italian luxo-barge. There's something a bit "Coupeish" about it. I know it looks nothing like the Coupe, but maybe its the snubbed high rear end.

The estate version of the Kappa, and four door are a bit hum-drum though.

No, why would they be cheapier parts?

not sure i thought it had been mentioned on here before?

maybe that is because you picked an image of the kappa coupe ?

Lum

hey enough of that nothing wron g with vag 5 pot engines my dads audi s6 has now done 230000 and still going strong and still got the same clutch and exhaust beleave it or not.

Hey, was only kidding man! I'm secretly a bit of a fan .... was planning to transplant a v.a.g 5 pot into my old MK1 Scirocco!
It just amuses me that v.a.g slating seems to be quite a pass-time round these parts

The Audi 5 pot is / was a fantastic and reliable motor, I took two to well over 150,000 miles.

Not too sure about the 20V 4cyl VAG lump though, the internals are fine but they suffered a LOT of other failures early on in their life.

Hmmm... my VAG 20vt engine's been fine for forty thousand, four years... the only issue it had was a leaky cam cover gasket, covered under warranty. I seem to recall an awful lot of new spark coils around 2002, though (just before mine).

someone told me fiat bought the design for the 20vt from audi and made it them self?

Nope, Fiat designed from scratch.

is there proof? id like to have a read up

It is definitely a Fiat design. The bore and stroke are different, the rod length is different. Most of the engine parts are shared with the 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0 Alfa 155, 156, GTV, GT engines, Fiat Bravo 1.8 HLX, Punto HGT etc etc.. So same rods, in some cases same pistons. The 5 pot was in the Lancia thesis and Kappa as well as the bravo and coupe. The 2.4 version in the Stilo is the 2.0 alfa engine with another pot like the 2.0 is a 1.6 alfa engine with another pot. The diesel 1.9 and 2.4JTDs are also related using some of the same parts.
Have a look on ePer and you will be amazed at the parts sharing that took place.

The 5-cylinder Fiat engine is of the Fiat Fire engine range. Official name was "Super FIRE 2.0" in which FIRE stands for "Fully Integrated Robotised Engine" - meaning it's a mass production engine.

http://www.autozine.org/Classiccar/html/Fiat/Coupe.html

The strange thing is that I can not find a list of the Fire engines that actually has the 5-cylinder in there, but definately I have read Fiat documentation noting the FIRE engine range had a bhp output from xx to 220bhp.

AHH - having searched Google for the above I now have a quote from the Fiat Forum:

FIRE is short write of "Fully-Integrated Robotised Engine", which is a series engine with simple design thus allowed robotised production. The first FIRE engine appeared in the mid-80's, displacing 999c.c. and used by Fiat Uno. Later, it differentiated into 0.9 litres, 1.1 litres and 1.25 litres which were extensively used by Panda, Uno, Cinquecento and Punto. It remains to be a low cost engine until upgraded as SUPER FIRE in 1995 followed the arrival of Brava / Bravo.

SUPER FIRE differs in mainly the aluminium alloy multi-valves cylinder head. It became a very large family consists of members with different details and purpose. Capacity ranging from 1.25 litres to 2.4 litres, power ranging from 80hp to 220hp, 4 cylinders or 5 cylinders, turbo or non-turbo, sohc or dohc, 3 valves per cylinder or 4 valves per cylinder, with variable valve timing or not, with balance shafts or not. It powered nearly all Punto, Brava, Bravo, Marea, Barchetta and Coupe. Moreover, Alfa Romeo also modified the SUPER FIRE engine into their 1.4, 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0 litres twin-spark units. Totally the SUPER FIRE differentiated into 12 engines, not including the diesel.

Had the Volvo one put to me at the Auto Italia show at Stanford Hall this year whilst on "Concours Duty"

interesting

This whole thread is one I never thought I would read!
Maybe on a VW forum but not here.

Loosely based??

Someone didn't see my controversial video on 'the best engine ever designed'!!

CAPS 'LAMPREDI' CAPS [ moderator coming]

Yes indeed, the great Aurelio Lampredi designed the original Fiat Twin Cam engine as used in the Fiat 125 to start with, then the 124 Special T, 124 Sport Coupe and Spider, 131, 132, etc etc...plus various Lancias of course including the Integrale.

Actually, Lampredi also made the great SOHC engine and the V6 (2.8 & 3.2l) used in Fiat 130.
The SOHC was first used in 128, last probably in the Punto GT..?
And in between; all the small Fiat's, Lancia's, Yugo's you can think of.