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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: Jim_Clennell]
#1420786
08/04/2013 21:26
08/04/2013 21:26
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,144 Southampton, Hants
Roadking
Club member 1809
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Club member 1809
Forum is my life
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,144
Southampton, Hants
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Won't mean our kids get free frikken milk in schools any more though. Maggie was years ahead of the current health Nazis. She helped reduce the exposure of our vulnerable young to the risk of future cholesterol issues caused by drinking full fat milk.
"RK's way seems the most sensible to me". ali_hire 16 Dec 2010
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420798
08/04/2013 21:56
08/04/2013 21:56
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,617 SE Essex
charlie_croker
I need some sleep
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I need some sleep
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,617
SE Essex
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I think in any way comparing Maggie Thatcher to Hitler is insulting and disrespectful, no matter what you thought of her.
Anyone even making such a comparison, even in jest should be ashamed of themselves.
Have some frikken respect, especially on Holocaust Memorial Day. Bloody ignorant fools. Your fathers or grandfathers who fought (and also died fighting) against Hitler, rescued the victims in the Concentration Camps and liberated Europe would be rolling in their graves.
And as our fathers or grandfathers fought to liberate the camps, did you know what was happening to British soldiers in Palestine? Read this Or that the Stern Gang (Jewish Freedom Fighters/Terrorists) offered to fight for the Nazis against the Allies? Read this Or the murder of two British Sergeants? Read this History makes for interesting reading, it's rarely black and white. Ironically the first use of a truck bomb was by Jewish Terrorists (or should that be freedom fighters?) against a British Police station And no, I am not anti-Zionist or Right Wing, but I do read a lot of history. I also find it quite ironic when an Israeli denounces an attack as terrorism List of terror attacks in Palestine
Last edited by charlie_croker; 08/04/2013 22:01.
Happy
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: charlie_croker]
#1420806
08/04/2013 22:22
08/04/2013 22:22
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,831 Haslemere, Surrey
Mark_S
Forum is my job
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Forum is my job
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,831
Haslemere, Surrey
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I used to hate that silver top school milk, especially when (1) warm and (2) previously enjoyed by blue tits.
997 C4S
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: charlie_croker]
#1420817
08/04/2013 22:40
08/04/2013 22:40
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,071 Chertsey in the Thames
bockers
Hon Club Member 007
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Hon Club Member 007
Forum Fossil
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 21,071
Chertsey in the Thames
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Well he must be right! Being a siplementary benefits claim officer during Maggies reign I saw first hand the destruction she caused. Changed my polotics completely. Maybe the unions had enjoyed too much power, but once that had been reduced they did not need destroying along with the industry they covered. I will not rejoice at her or anyones death, but I will not shed a tear either.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: Brewster]
#1420832
08/04/2013 23:31
08/04/2013 23:31
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,327 Merthyr tydfil
Gareth_M
My job on the forum
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My job on the forum
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,327
Merthyr tydfil
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I think she should be Sainted and interred at the recently closed Maltby colliery, turning it into a shrine. I'm sure the local community would approve. Not sure about the sainted bit, but I agree her corpse should be put down a mine shaft. People who are then so inclined, could pay a small fee (say £10.00) to take a crap down the very deep hole. I think it would work wonders, and the national dept could be paid off by next thursday.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: Gareth_M]
#1420838
08/04/2013 23:42
08/04/2013 23:42
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sparkyman
Unregistered
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sparkyman
Unregistered
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I think she should be Sainted and interred at the recently closed Maltby colliery, turning it into a shrine. I'm sure the local community would approve. Not sure about the sainted bit, but I agree her corpse should be put down a mine shaft. People who are then so inclined, could pay a small fee (say £10.00) to take a crap down the very deep hole. I think it would work wonders, and the national dept could be paid off by next thursday.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420855
09/04/2013 00:16
09/04/2013 00:16
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,748 Pistonheads
Brewster
Forum is my life
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Forum is my life
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,748
Pistonheads
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Yeah, the National Coal Board, British Rail, British Steel and British Leyland were all providing top class goods at knock down prices due to not servicing shareholders weren't they? Or perhaps they were already more expensive at point of sale than privatised companies, despite being heavily subsidised in taxes too.
Greedy miners were holding the country to energy ransom for extortionate pay rises, British Railways were expensive and famed for never running on time, British Leyland were turning out world class competition to Volkswagen such as the Allegro made with British Steel that was overpriced and of such poor quality that cars were rolling off the production line already rusty.
She did what was necessary and crushed the lazy, unionised, subsidised national industries that did very little except turn out overpriced, poor quality goods and services at great cost to the tax payer and also the direct customer.
As I said - she won. Great Britain won. The only people that are bitter about it are those who lost their easy meal ticket paid for out of the public purse.
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Re: Maggie Thatcher dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420860
09/04/2013 00:37
09/04/2013 00:37
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Lego
Unregistered
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Lego
Unregistered
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Unfortunately she died of old age and outlived many of those that she inflicted suffering and misery on and I can take no great pleasure in a frail old woman's passing. Those who measure life through wealth, hold her in high esteem. In my country she was almost universally hated for reasons that those who hold her in high regard could never understand. I would have prefered she had died in her prime, and I would have then danced on her grave and raised a glass in joy and celebration with many of you, and many of the great friends and family who alas have now passed away. My thoughts are with them on this day.
Last edited by Lego; 09/04/2013 00:40.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420865
09/04/2013 00:46
09/04/2013 00:46
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,748 Pistonheads
Brewster
Forum is my life
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Forum is my life
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,748
Pistonheads
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The thing is, Volumex, I genuinely believe that nearly everything she did as PM was borne out of a desire to make the country a fairer, more prosperous place. The only people who are bitter are the socialists who wanted to have their share "fairer" than everyone else.
Last edited by Brewster; 09/04/2013 00:47. Reason: For clarity
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420874
09/04/2013 02:00
09/04/2013 02:00
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,327 Merthyr tydfil
Gareth_M
My job on the forum
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My job on the forum
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,327
Merthyr tydfil
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Brewster, I really dont have the time to argue on here. We will never agree, and i think the only thing we can agree on is the futility in us continuing this. I think i have laid out my feelings on Thatcher, im sure no one will be in any doubt which side of the fence im on.
As for your insistence that privatisation is great.... Ill agree with you, IF you can give me one single example that a sell off to the privste sector made that srctor, moreefficieny, less costly and privided a better service. In all cases, services been degraded, while money is creamed off the top to shareholders, instead of being re invested. .. Privitisation should have been illegal. It wasn't theirs to sell. It was mine, and it was yours.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: Brewster]
#1420879
09/04/2013 06:25
09/04/2013 06:25
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,072 South Cambs
Barmybob
Hon Club Member: 003
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Hon Club Member: 003
Je suis un Coupé
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,072
South Cambs
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The thing is, Volumex, I genuinely believe that nearly everything she did as PM was borne out of a desire to make the country a fairer, more prosperous place. The only people who are bitter are the socialists who wanted to have their share "fairer" than everyone else. The unions may have been powerful but they were mostly reeling from what had gone before. Everything needs to be placed in correct context and perspective. Regrettably you, as always, wish to ignore this in favour of sound bite. During the lifetime of many 70’s union members & leaders they had suffered the thirties depression, forced labour camps and then fought for the country that so undervalued them. Many of these workers had lived through times of great unfairness and wanted that to change. For decades the working class were exploited and these folks wanted to redress the balance. Did they go too far, want too much, and too quickly? Undoubtedly You can say what you want about the 70’s hard times but the fact is the economic hardship was felt by ALL sections of society. This is one thing thatcher did change. Every economic downturn since has been distinctly unfair, the more wealthy you were the less likely you have had to endure the pain. Just look at today.. To insist Mrs T’s motives were to create a fairer, more prosperous place are a farce. The majority of people were only ever credit card & debt prosperous. It was a greed culture that has led to the debt culture we find ourselves in today. We Brits have one of the largest personal debt burdens in the world. The largest sector of our economy is finance, much of which is based upon us buying and selling our property / homes. Many of our European neighbours kept their industrial powerbase ticking over, we laughed at them and said they were stupid. Today they are still building / Making stuff and exporting their products to the developing world. They didn’t lose their bottle and fall into the “They can make it cheaper elsewhere, so let’s sell up” trap as far as we did. We lumped almost all our eggs into the finance basket, rode the wave but eventually screwed ourselves. We still have a slim chance to innovate but we stuck in niche markets. Nationalisation doesn’t work argument…… Oddly our European neighbours didn’t agree and they didn’t destroy their nationalised industries, they actually embraced and developed them. Today many of those companies now own and manage much of the UK PLC that Mrs T sold to them… Perhaps she should be known as the “Irony Lady” Yes I hold socialist beliefs and value not for profit culture & business. You can spit on my beliefs and even suggest that I would seek to have my share fairer than everyone else. But this just isn’t true. You know me, have I ever behaved or acted in any way that was unfair. I suggest I have always been shown and proven to hold fast my beliefs, even to the point others have exploited me! Sadly I feel it’s often those who feel they should be entitled to more who seek the fairer share. Their assessment is never based on evidence, they just know they deserve it.
Gone Audi mad!
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: MeanRedSpider]
#1420884
09/04/2013 08:02
09/04/2013 08:02
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,831 Haslemere, Surrey
Mark_S
Forum is my job
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Forum is my job
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,831
Haslemere, Surrey
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I don't think any union members would remember forced labour camps....? My brother-in-law was auditing in Fleet Street (early 80s) and I still recall him being told he could not move a particular chair, something to do with union rules
997 C4S
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: ]
#1420885
09/04/2013 08:20
09/04/2013 08:20
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,568 Berlin
barnacle
Club Member 18 - ex-Minister without Portfolio
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Club Member 18 - ex-Minister without Portfolio
Forum Demigod
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 33,568
Berlin
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The problem with a two-party system is that one *has* to be the diametric opposite of the other on any subject, irrespective of whether the viewpoint has any rationale to it.
Like a few of the other posters here, I was there and working before, during, and after Thatcher's rule. I was a member of a union for thirty years - but I also refused to pay a political levy long before it became a legal right so to do. I believe that a union is there to provide a common negotiating position between employees and employers, not something with which to hold employers to ransom; not something to featherbed employees with pay rises and position based on time of employment instead of ability; not something to provide rigid demarcation between jobs. There's little doubt to me - recalling the piled rubbish and the power cuts and Red Robbo pulling out the Leyland workers once again and Scargill's megalomania - that limiting the unions' powers was essential. Instead of representing the workers the vast majority were there for the political ambition of their leaders.
Thatcher made a major mistake with the 'right to buy' campaign. It was an obvious and not very successful attempt to bribe votes from council tenants; since it removed rental properties while paying way less than replacement costs and still leaving the councils with a duty to provide housing could only leave a shortage of cheap rental housing that persists to this day; net result is ridiculous rents paid to third parties who, remarkably enough, charge all the market will bear.
Privatising national infrastructure industries... not convinced that selling me something I already own at a knock down price so I can sell the shares immediately and make a quick buck and then watch the mess of cross-selling and downright fraud that the delivery of those services descended into should ever have been legal. Once again, it's a classic case of 'all the market will bear' disguised as complex pricing 'schemes' and companies who employ more people as sales 'executives' persuading me to swap from one to the other than they do on the infrastructure? Does water from one supplier taste better than from another? Does the gas smell sweeter? Is the electricity more sinusoidal? Now we end up in the position that we have to beg foreign governments to allow their (mostly government owned) companies to build us a nuclear power station or two...
I could go on.
There is no doubt that Thatcher was a strong person; she had her views and policies and stuck to them - whether they made sense or not. Unlike probably most of the people here, the nature of my job was such that I met her several times. In a social context, she was friendly and reasonable and persuasive; as a politician she was a demagogue as extreme as any other.
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Re: Maggie Thatchier dead !!
[Re: barnacle]
#1420902
09/04/2013 09:56
09/04/2013 09:56
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852 Cambridge & Cotswolds
MeanRedSpider
Je suis un Coupé
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Je suis un Coupé
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,852
Cambridge & Cotswolds
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Privatising national infrastructure industries... not convinced that selling me something I already own at a knock down price so I can sell the shares immediately and make a quick buck and then watch the mess of cross-selling and downright fraud that the delivery of those services descended into should ever have been legal.
I'm interested in this. It wasn't long before that many of these industries were nationalised - I'm not sure any of them started as government bodies (railways, mines, steel etc were mostly started in the industrial revolution by private individuals). What makes going in one direction right but going back the other way wrong? I'm genuinely interested to understand this
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