'Common people' was not a derogatory comment, in fact the reverse is true; it was to encompass anyone who was not part of the Establishment, the plebeians/us

What I would say is that since the referendum the populist rhetoric espoused by the 'leave lobby' has gone desperately flat. It has not and probably will never materialise in policy or practice. Many of the leave slogans and soundbites used to sway people to vote leave was pure gerrymandering.

I would go so far as to say leaving the EU is a step backwards towards a more nationalist, imperialist and a continued erosion of UK citizens rights (employment, legal etc). The leave vote for most people I have spoken to appears to revolve around the key factor of immigration, unfortunately for them, leaving the EU will have no real impact on immigration levels given the UK needs this influx for the capitalist economy to function now and in the future.

"a continued erosion of UK citizens rights"

I'm curious to know which of your rights are being continuously eroded?

My right to access the law and seek redress against the State....an inability to gain legal aid for many cases and the prohibitive rising costs of litigation e.g employment matters, family matters, Tribunals etc.

The destruction of collective bargaining and Trade Unionism, the erosion of workers and consumers rights...note the Tory Govt refuses to confirm this will be enshrined in any future Acts post Brexit and their total inaction with regards to issues such as zero hour contracts. The loss of in work benefits. The rise once again of Mercantilism.

Routine rather than targeted surveillance by the SIS's, the continued curbing of freedom of expression and protest, closed courts etc.

The UK's desire post Brexit not to commit to future pollution targets....odd since NO2 levels in London were above their yearly target in just 4 days and the continued impact this will have on the populations' health.

The huge amount of Secondary Legislation passed into Law each year never having been debated by our elected representatives nor forming any part of a Government's manifesto....an 'elected dictatorship.'

The future inability to seek redress with the ECJ against UK Government rulings and legislation which infringes rights or freedoms.

The repeal of The Human Rights Act, loss of the ECHR and a replacement Bill of Rights which will be driven by wants of the elite/Establishment not the needs of the people.

One benefit though was the political demise of Cameron and Osbourne, that said it appears despite May's rhetoric it's business as usual with the Tories.

Oh, those ones.

Presumably, as we haven't left the EU yet, it must've happened under their watch, so they're not exactly protecting your rights now are they.

I believe they have but one can only imagine how it will get much worse with no HRA, or ECJ to turn to, please don't fret though I am sure the Tories will put the correct spin on it to sell it as a positive thing for the UK to have all of the above and more and great for John Bull's Britain!

So you're complaining about things that haven't happened and may possibly not happen.

I hate it when it rains next Wednesday too.

It's interesting how the optimists voted "leave" and the pessimists voted "remain".

If "remoaners" put half as much effort into moving on then the atmosphere wouldn't be half as down as it is now.

cracking comment !

Did you notice Tony B-liar in London today at the unveiling.......surprised he dared to show his face. Eh lad, bring back the labour , with red leftie still living in the 70s leading the party , maybe Scargill could take up politics and be his no2 !! One out, everybody out .

For that type of optimism read fascism

And there, in a nutshell, is why the remain campaign lost.

Really? I think it was mainly down to complacency among the establishment and lies by the Leave campaign that captured the imagination and votes of people desperately seeking something to believe in.
Farage and Trump both understand the value of propaganda and the relative lack of value of truth.

There are many people who have well-thought out and valid reasons for voting Leave, but if anyone thinks that they are what led to a majority, then that, in a nutshell, is why the vote for Brexit appears deeply depressing to "remoaners".

Yes, really. But it's a moot point.

Moaning is a brit (English?) pastime and they'll be a hell of a lot more of it before the dust settles.

Well, as 'they' see it, it's a wonderful opportunity for the UK. As *I* see it, they've just kicked my feet out from under me after forty years of saving and planning.

Moaning? Nope - just trying the best I can to get back on track even though it's unlikely to happen. It's hard to steer a safe course when the clouds cover the moon and the waves are actively trying to drown you.

I reiterate my original point: no matter how 'good' or otherwise the economy is doing, my net worth anywhere except in the UK has reduced by fifteen or twenty percent.

(btw: economy doing well = 3% increase in GDP, measured in UKP which have devalued 15-20% against the two main currencies with which it trades. How's that again?)

As a Brit who lives in France, it seems to me that the referendum has split the UK and generated a lot of hate. I don't understand this "left behind" nonsense. Everyone has an MP, everyone has an MEP so everyone has an opportunity to lobby their representatives. If they are unable or unwilling to do so then they only have themselves to blame. Being in the EU gave the UK over 40 years of peace and prosperity, the ability to move and work freely in the EU. I have a wry smile when I see English bars etc in tourist areas of Spain, Greece etc, or when I hear Brits living in France looking for English speaking hairdressers, dentist etc.The world is a big place that are worth experiencing rather than restricting yourself to English culture. I frequently get asked about whether things are better in the UK or France and I reply that they are different. Some things are better, some are worse but you adapt to your situation. What was wrong was that UK tax paying citizens living in the EU for more than 15 yaers were not allowed to vote. No taxation without representation. Perhaps the UK should consider not taxing UK citizens who do not have a vote.

I'm in a similar position to you Guzbod, except across one more border from the UK and I agree with almost everything you allude to. Only, if we live abroad, we don't pay taxes in the UK but in our chosen home, right? We are usually allowed to vote in the UK but were singled out from voting in the last referendum, the result of which actually affects us whereas general election results affect us much less.

AH, but you have to realise that for the True Englishman[tm] the world stops once your feet are wet.

The world is full of Johnny Foreigner, and we don't want his type over here in England's green and pleasant lands. As for those Englishmen like you and me, we're obviously not True Englishmen, since otherwise we'd be perfectly happy in God's Own Country and not tainted by this perverse desire to see the world (or even (whisper the words) live or work in it).

Let's hear if for the Daily Mail (and its ilk) and the scumbags who write it and read it - because, well, the news was always good. We were never at war with Oceana.

We are happy to sell to anyone (and may even buy from them) but we don't want to live next door to them or meet them in the pub ...

We actually need an influx of younger people in nations with stagnant populations and desires for economic growth. Most are an essential contributing part of the economy but are being labelled as the cause of all ills that have befallen a basically poorly governed country.

Fewer will want to come now anyway. Remove the rest and wait for everything to magically turn to gold

The EU gave everyone on this Island freedom to move anywhere in Europe to seek new opportunities or just take a chance of a different life. This is the opportunity many eastern Europeans and indeed many Brits took, indeed several people on this forum are in this group.

Brexit is phase one of getting the average bod back in their box, and we voted for it.

The booming UK property market made it possible for many Brits to realise their property asset and seek a new life in a cheaper part of Europe. Never before had working bods had such a freedom, the chance to take a different direction even retire to the sun. We were protected by freedom of movement rules and basic healthcare. After Brexit most Brits won't be able to follow this path any more.

Wealthy folks will be able meet the criteria for citizenship that will apply to non-EU citizens. These often require a 500K Euro property investment and a similar level in savings. Aye, we bods all have the opportunity to realise a Million Euro's don't we!

The only funny thing is that many of the bods who voted out are yet to fully realise that Brexit has killed their dream of a retirement in the sun. Quite sad that I'll derive a degree of schadenfreude as reality kicks and they realise they'll probably be stuck in their semi for the rest of their lives, or at least until they have to sell it to pay for healthcare costs!

An idea - everyone who voted remain and doesn't like what democracy has given them should move to Scotland and vote for independence. Then if independence happens, and Europe will have them, they can live in Europhile bliss. You may be a bit colder but perhaps your hearts will be warmer.

It's funny that the people who voted out did it mainly because of the 'lies' spread by the Leave campaign and the desire to prevent immigration.

I voted 'leave,' yet my personal view is that the number of immigrants has been of huge benefit to our country for the past few decades. As for the lies from the Leave side, it's laughable that a supporter of either cause could raise this as an argument. The whole campaign (from both sides) was littered with inaccuracies, lies and unsubstantiated 'evidence.'

I was 50/50 until pretty much the day before the referendum as to which way I was going to vote and then I heard someone trotting out a line about the 'markets.' It was a pathetic suggestion - we should base our country's future upon the worry that the market traders would quickly sell shares, stocks, bonds etc in a mad panic, leading to a market crash? The fact that our country has become completely reliant on an industry which produces nothing and contributes nothing to society, when the governing party systematically destroyed the manufacturing industry over many years is gut-wrenching.

The majority of people (in my opinion) who voted to leave, were not basing their judgement on the absolute crap spouted by politicians, nor purely on immigration - sorry to all those who think the Daily Mail actually influence the population - but because of a political ideal that perhaps we can stand on our own two feet. It may be misplaced, it may backfire spectacularly, but so far it's not been the war-inducing catalyst which the Remain campaign suggested (sorry, I forgot that the lies and myths only came from those on the leave side). In fact, Call Me Dave has gone, Gideon Osborne has been taken away from the money chest, Michael Gove is ruined and Boris is on the way to well-deserved international ridicule, so overall not too bad really.

I think one of the problems with the referendum is that, despite what was a relatively small majority, the result is absolute. Compare that to the Scottish referendum where the losing side won a lot of concessions from the UK governement on the basis of a small majority. It also left the door open (as has been shown this week) for another vote on the basis of new facts.

I'm not saying that there should be another Brexit vote but it irks me when people say "we voted" for Brexit. I didn't. The popular vote won - that doesn't make it a good idea.

From memory, most areas of Scotland voted to stay in the UK. Dear old Nicola's supporters mainly lived in the two major cities of Glasgow and Edinburgh, so how she reckons ' scotland ' is behind her baffles me. Best thing for Nicola..... .......do us all a favour, so no more of that whinging mare every day in the news !

......and if scotland left the uk, team GB would gain hardly any medals at the next olympics !

Any evidence for that? Everything I have seen suggests otherwise.

So according to some news/media reports Nicola Sturgeon has abandoned plans to rejoin Europe after the referendum2 because surveys show the majority of Scots are Eurosceptic and don't want to join !!!! But isn't that how she justified the "ref2" ?

Does she have some sort of vested interest in all this ?

2012 London Edit
Medal Name[2][3] Sport Event
Gold Andy Murray Tennis Men's singles
Gold Chris Hoy Track cycling Men's team sprint
Gold Chris Hoy Track cycling Men's keirin
Gold Heather Stanning Rowing Women's coxless pair
Gold Katherine Grainger Rowing Women's double sculls
Gold Scott Brash Equestrian Team jumping
Gold Timothy Baillie Canoe slalom Men's C-2 team
Silver Andy Murray Tennis Mixed doubles
Silver David Florence Canoe slalom Men's C-2 team
Silver Luke Patience Sailing Men's 470
Silver Michael Jamieson Swimming Men's 200 metres breaststroke
Bronze Daniel Purvis Artistic gymnastics Men's team all-round
Bronze Laura Bartlett Field hockey Women's tournament
Bronze Emily Maguire Field hockey Women's tournament
2016 Rio Edit
Medal Name Sport Event
Gold Andy Murray Tennis Men's singles
Gold Callum Skinner Track cycling Men's team sprint
Gold Heather Stanning Rowing Women's coxless pair
Gold Katie Archibald Track cycling Women's team pursuit
Silver Daniel Wallace Swimming Men's 4×200 metre freestyle relay
Silver Duncan Scott Swimming Men's 4×200 metre freestyle relay
Silver Robert Renwick[note 1] Swimming Men's 4×200 metres freestyle relay
Silver Stephen Milne Swimming Men's 4×200 metre freestyle relay
Silver Duncan Scott Swimming Men's 4×100 metre medley relay
Silver Katherine Grainger Rowing Women's double sculls
Silver David Florence Canoe slalom Men's C–2 team
Silver Mark Bennett Rugby sevens Men's tournament
Silver Mark Robertson Rugby sevens Men's tournament
Silver Callum Skinner Track cycling Men's individual sprint
Silver Karen Bennett Rowing Women's eights
Silver Polly Swann Rowing Women's eights
Bronze Sally Conway Judo Women's –70 kilograms
Bronze Eilidh Doyle Athletics Women's 4 × 400 metres relay

So in 2012, Scotland won 7 G, 4 S, 3 B
And in 2016, Scotland won 4 G, 12 S, 2 B

Out of a total for GB in 2012 of 29 G, 17 S, 19 B
And in 2016 the GB total was 27 G, 23 S, 17 B

So percent of GB medals won by Scotland
in 2012 24% G, 24% S, 16% B
in 2016 15% G, 52% S, 12% B

GB without Scotland would have won the following
in 2012 22 G, 13 S, 16 B
in 2016 23 G, 11 S, 15 B

...which is not "hardly any medals"

Not even that Dave.

I think the Team GB totals you have used doesnt include team medals for each competitor e.g. there is only 1 silver for the rugby 7s but the list above has the 2 silvers for rugby sevens for Scotland meaning there are another 10 silvers that aren't for Scotland.

Rio totals actually loo like this
Gold 68
Silver 56
Bronze 31

So it would be
Gold 64
Silver 44
Bronze 29
for Team GB without Scotland at Rio.

The medals totals for each home nation (and other team GB competitors) is split along the same proportions of numbers of athletes competing give or take a few %.

I thought about not replying to this thread